Tanla Platforms Limited — Q4 FY26

Tanla Platforms Ltd Q4 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8w1Bdf0Yze4 Published: 2 weeks ago

0:01 1 second Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Tanla Platforms Limited Q4 FY26 earnings conference call. As a 0:09 9 seconds reminder, all participant lines will be in the listenon only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation 0:16 16 seconds concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star and then zero on your touchtone phone. 0:26 26 seconds Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Ritu Ma. Thank you and over to you ma'am. 0:36 36 seconds A very good evening and a warm welcome to the Q4 earnings call. Joining with us today are UD Reddi founder chairman and 0:43 43 seconds CEO Deepak Goyel executive director and Anubha Patra CFO. Before we start the call, let me draw your attention to the 0:52 52 seconds fact that today's discussion may feature statements that are forward-looking in nature. All statements other than statements of historical fact could be 1:00 1 minute deemed forward-looking in nature. Such statements are inherently subject to risk and uncertainties, some of which cannot be quantified or predicted. A 1:09 1 minute, 9 seconds detailed disclosure in this regard is mentioned in the results presentation that is uploaded on our website. audio recording and transfer approval soon. 1:18 1 minute, 18 seconds Hope everybody got a chance to go through our investor presentation and shareholder letter. The management will be happy to answer questions and we will 1:26 1 minute, 26 seconds now open the floor for Q&A. Sor over to you. Thank you very much. 1:35 1 minute, 35 seconds We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and then one on their touchstone phone. 1:44 1 minute, 44 seconds If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. 1:50 1 minute, 50 seconds Participants are requested to use handsets while asking your question. 1:55 1 minute, 55 seconds Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question assembles. 2:10 2 minutes, 10 seconds Participants, you may press star and then one to ask a question. Our first question comes from the line of 2:19 2 minutes, 19 seconds Deepak Chokani from Raid Capital. Please go ahead. 2:24 2 minutes, 24 seconds Uh thank you for this opportunity. I have three questions. Uh we have cash of,000 cr and of course the dividend uh 2:33 2 minutes, 33 seconds is uh is pretty handsomely given along with buybacks. I was just wondering why not why not think of some acquisitions 2:41 2 minutes, 41 seconds in in AI space especially voice and why not explore acquisitions in related areas which can propel our growth. 2:48 2 minutes, 48 seconds That's my first question. Second question is last call I think was told that by March uh the company will sign 2:57 2 minutes, 57 seconds another ATP deal with one more bank. So just want an update on that. And the 3:02 3 minutes, 2 seconds last question is we have 12 crores of FX loss. Of course I know I mean the USD has moved sharply against the rupee. 3:12 3 minutes, 12 seconds However, are we not hedging and if at all if we are hedging then what what went wrong and how can we avoid this in future and also can we show this as a 3:21 3 minutes, 21 seconds separate line item in the P&L? Of course, it's mentioned in the investor presentation, but I think it'll help the investors to to have more clarity and assess the overall AIDA in a proper way. 3:32 3 minutes, 32 seconds That's it. Thanks. 3:35 3 minutes, 35 seconds Hi Deepak. Yeah. So the let me answer the first and second question and third question I will pass on to though we had a very extensive discussion on the 3:44 3 minutes, 44 seconds hedging in in our last board meeting. So when it comes to the acquisition like um we're pretty open uh but but we are not 3:52 3 minutes, 52 seconds really actively not looking for any acquisition but we're pretty open. Um so as and when we find uh right investments 3:59 3 minutes, 59 seconds I think uh we we we are quite keen but but you know we always build believe in uh build versus uh buy right and all 4:08 4 minutes, 8 seconds these air companies are are the I mean the expectations are skyrocketing so we 4:15 4 minutes, 15 seconds need to be real mindful uh so so we would would rather focus on build versus 4:22 4 minutes, 22 seconds buy. So that's what my that's what my my formula is. That's number one. Number two, ATP. Yes, we have signed the la 4:29 4 minutes, 29 seconds third deal. Uh in fact, we went live uh last month. Uh this we added the third uh bank which is the Bondan banks. Uh so 4:38 4 minutes, 38 seconds so we already integrated we went live with them. Uh I think we built for one month this build one month for the for the for the Q4 of of last year. 4:50 4 minutes, 50 seconds And in terms of the hedging. 4:52 4 minutes, 52 seconds Yeah. So Deepak on hedging basically it's a non-cash item because of mark tom market of some payables. Um do we do 5:00 5 minutes have a hedging policy and honestly uh our international payable and receivable provide a natural hedge but this one is 5:07 5 minutes, 7 seconds more of a specific uh you know liability balance sheet item which uh got restated and it obviously because of the USD INR 5:16 5 minutes, 16 seconds uh excessive fluctuation uh this hit us badly in this quarter but we did call it out separately so that uh you know all 5:24 5 minutes, 24 seconds the investors may get a fair view of uh our operational profitability. ility. Um we are reworking on our hedging policy 5:31 5 minutes, 31 seconds to see if we can reduce the exposure and it uh it will get addressed not just by the policy but also we're trying to 5:38 5 minutes, 38 seconds settle this um uh balance sheet item to ensure that there is a minimalistic P&L 5:45 5 minutes, 45 seconds volatility in the coming quarters. Um because the timing of this payout was not certain we could not go ahead and do 5:53 5 minutes, 53 seconds a forward cover to this because of the uncertainty of timing of the cash flow. 5:57 5 minutes, 57 seconds Um but we would want to take it out away from our balance sheet as as soon as possible to reduce the volatility. So 6:06 6 minutes, 6 seconds right understood. So just a follow-up question uh this sir on on the first point I do understand that the valuations are uh pretty high on the AI 6:14 6 minutes, 14 seconds space. So you you prefer building something versus acquiring. So could you could you just tell us what what new 6:21 6 minutes, 21 seconds products are we working on? uh and and what new platforms you may be working on. uh if you can just throw some light 6:29 6 minutes, 29 seconds on that Deepak I think it's not a fair enough part to to to share our innovation road 6:37 6 minutes, 37 seconds back road 6:39 6 minutes, 39 seconds road road road road road road road road 6:46 6 minutes, 46 seconds this this quarter um so so really we have been betting big on this platform for quite some time I I'm personally 6:54 6 minutes, 54 seconds working on this platform the last 40 days I I think we we we should able to announce the market um in the next probably uh a month's time. 7:05 7 minutes, 5 seconds Superb. All the best sir. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. 7:12 7 minutes, 12 seconds Our next question comes from the line of Kesha Girk from Counter Cyclical PMS. Please go ahead. 7:19 7 minutes, 19 seconds Sir, I'm new to the company so please pardon my ignorance. I am just trying to understand why our operating margins are 7:27 7 minutes, 27 seconds uh continuously falling since FI22 and have they stabilized at these levels 7:33 7 minutes, 33 seconds now at 16% AITA or or do you see further dip or you see the same margin profile 7:41 7 minutes, 41 seconds going forward or you expect a bounce back from these levels? 7:46 7 minutes, 46 seconds So uh cash anov here um we do have seen a decline but honestly we have become rangebound if you if you look at it the 7:53 7 minutes, 53 seconds operating profits at a gross margin level have improved uh uh slightly in last couple of quarters. Uh at the same 8:01 8 minutes, 1 second time at IVITA level we are making some conscious investments in GTM and we have called it out in earlier earnings call as well on both innovation side and GTM 8:11 8 minutes, 11 seconds side we're investing in growth. So because of that uh the IITA percentage uh appears to be where it is. Uh but we 8:19 8 minutes, 19 seconds do see them improving as well as at least holding on uh in the near future and uh our investments are going to 8:26 8 minutes, 26 seconds continue on the GTM side. Uh but uh they will bear fruits uh in the coming quarters and you already see that some marginal improvement have happened on the gross margin profile. 8:38 8 minutes, 38 seconds Uh great. Uh that's really reassuring to hear. And what about the top line? Uh looking at the kind of uh demand and feedback from our customers and so on. 8:50 8 minutes, 50 seconds What kind of broad range do you expect the revenue for the next uh let's say 3 to 5 years that in our business we can sustain? 9:01 9 minutes, 1 second Uh Deepak, you want to take that question? Deepak. Hey. Hi. 9:11 9 minutes, 11 seconds Yeah. So uh you see uh we are seeing uh you know a growth of overall a revenue 9:20 9 minutes, 20 seconds uh growth of CPASS industry for about you can say 8 uh% on an average uh 8 to 10% uh that is organic growth how how 9:28 9 minutes, 28 seconds the industry is growing and uh we see ourselves uh you know uh you know uh 9:36 9 minutes, 36 seconds running a larger share on uh on year-on-year basis uh right We we expect that our market share would also 9:44 9 minutes, 44 seconds increase with the kind of investments we have made and uh so yeah so you can I mean uh it's going to be definitely more than uh 10% a year. 9:56 9 minutes, 56 seconds Okay. Okay. Understood. And uh uh sir if you could just give us some idea about what has been the experience of our 10:05 10 minutes, 5 seconds counterparts in western countries like the advanced markets of let's say US. So are they still intermediates like us? Uh 10:14 10 minutes, 14 seconds the the role that we are playing in India. Uh are they similar companies or they have a integrated model wherein the Telos or some or or the WhatsApp etc. 10:24 10 minutes, 24 seconds they they are directly doing what we are doing. 10:29 10 minutes, 29 seconds If I understood your Yeah. Yeah. If I understood your question uh correctly you are saying you know the model the working model of Casplay are the same as 10:38 10 minutes, 38 seconds India and the US. Yeah. The answer is yes. In fact, uh there are few companies, international companies, they operate in India as well as in the US 10:47 10 minutes, 47 seconds for example, Cench, right? Uh and and and there are more. So yeah, it's more or less it's it's the same. 10:54 10 minutes, 54 seconds Okay. So what is our right to win like uh the example you gave of Bandan Bank who has recently joined us or is 11:02 11 minutes, 2 seconds expected to join our customer list. So our competitors what is their proposition versus what is our 11:08 11 minutes, 8 seconds proposition? Is it 100% pricing based or is there something else also which ts the balance in our favor? 11:17 11 minutes, 17 seconds Uh see it is always innovationled. 11:20 11 minutes, 20 seconds Okay. Uh so if you uh if you that's what you know we always believe in having a differentiator over our competitors and 11:27 11 minutes, 27 seconds that's why our customers uh you know always uh keep their faith in us. So that reflects in our customer base if 11:36 11 minutes, 36 seconds you look at it any seven or eight uh top 10 uh names in any vertical if you if you pick up you'll find them as our 11:44 11 minutes, 44 seconds customers. Having said that you you talk about Bundan Bank. So what u mentioned Bundan Bank was our we acquired them for our anti-ishing platform which is again 11:53 11 minutes, 53 seconds a you know great innovation which we did couple of years back and uh we are getting very good traction in the market 12:00 12 minutes and it and Bundan Bank has been using our CPA services for quite some time uh from caris anyway. 12:09 12 minutes, 9 seconds Understood. And what is the kind of capex that we are looking at on a peranom basis? I can see that over the 12:16 12 minutes, 16 seconds past 3 4 years it's between 100 and 150 ko. So is that trajectory expected to continue? 12:27 12 minutes, 27 seconds What is the question? So can you please repeat? 12:31 12 minutes, 31 seconds Yeah. So I just wanted to get a hang about the capex requirements in this business. Over the past four five years it seems we are doing something like 100 12:39 12 minutes, 39 seconds to 150 kores per anom. So is that trajectory expected to continue in the future 100 to 150 K perom capex? 12:48 12 minutes, 48 seconds Yes. Yes. Yes. Absolutely. Yes. 12:51 12 minutes, 51 seconds Okay sir. Understood. So thank you very much and uh I must congratulate for a very timely share buyback and the excellent dividend payout. So on behalf 13:00 13 minutes of all the shareholders I want to thank you. Thanks a lot. Thank you. 13:08 13 minutes, 8 seconds A reminder to all the participants, if you wish to register for a question, please press star and then one. Our next 13:15 13 minutes, 15 seconds question comes from the line of tropes Shukla from Bullseye. Please go ahead. 13:22 13 minutes, 22 seconds Thanks. Thanks for the opportunity. I have actually two question from the digital platform segment. Uh my first 13:30 13 minutes, 30 seconds question is given the exceptional 98.3% gross margin of digital platform segment this is clearly the uh growth hind 13:39 13 minutes, 39 seconds profitability future profitability but however achieving 395 cr in 2016 in 13:46 13 minutes, 46 seconds single growth despite of your heavy so can you provide a broad 13:54 13 minutes, 54 seconds your voice uh sorry to disturb you your voice is cracking M um okay I think you have a very bad network why she's cracking. 14:04 14 minutes, 4 seconds Uh okay uh sir I just wanted to know that 395 cr digital platform segment 14:11 14 minutes, 11 seconds which represents single uh digit growth despite investment in visi. So can you provide broad growth target vision for 14:20 14 minutes, 20 seconds FY27 and FY28 and specifically what percentage of uh your FY27 target is already logged in via signed contracts or committed pipelines. 14:36 14 minutes, 36 seconds So uh uh digital platforms has a contribution from our traditional offerings as well as new offerings like 14:44 14 minutes, 44 seconds vi.ai AI while the growth looks uh little moderate it is because some products are dependent on the channel based growth which are growing at a 14:52 14 minutes, 52 seconds steady pace. However, Y.AI uh kind of platforms obviously are growing at a much faster pace. Uh you would have seen that we onboarded one 15:01 15 minutes, 1 second large telco uh globally and it contributed to a significant number this uh year. We basically expect the growth 15:10 15 minutes, 10 seconds to be much faster in the coming years because of our uh we will we would like to multiply our efforts on um on bio.ai 15:19 15 minutes, 19 seconds and it should it should actually bear more fruits in the coming quarters where we would be able to convert more of such 15:27 15 minutes, 27 seconds uh customers and the growth rate should accelerate. 15:30 15 minutes, 30 seconds Okay. uh can you provide me the percentage like the growth target and anything for F27 and sorry we don't actually issue any you 15:39 15 minutes, 39 seconds know um forwardlooking statement so I can't give a specific percentage but definitely we would want to aspire for higher percentage growth than the past 15:48 15 minutes, 48 seconds okay uh so sir's question like you have highlighted that 200 cr in revenue came from new logos and that 23% of the new 15:57 15 minutes, 57 seconds client onboarded via uh WhatsApp and RPL So could you break down how much of uh 16:04 16 minutes, 4 seconds that flow flow directly into digital platform segment and further more looking at 50 client what is the current 16:12 16 minutes, 12 seconds uh cost uh uh sales conversion rate migrating from them? 16:19 16 minutes, 19 seconds Sorry your voice is actually breaking quite a bit. The question is not clear. 16:25 16 minutes, 25 seconds Hello. Ma'am, if you're using uh Ma'am, if you're using a speaker phone or any external headset, may I request you to use the handset? 16:33 16 minutes, 33 seconds Okay. I'm audible now. 16:40 16 minutes, 40 seconds So, let her come back. Uh um let her come back. 16:45 16 minutes, 45 seconds Sure. U ma'am, we request you to uh try calling us once again and take your 16:52 16 minutes, 52 seconds questions. Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Amit Chandra from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead. 17:02 17 minutes, 2 seconds Yes sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Uh so my first question is on the know enterprise business. Obviously we are back on growth in the enterprise side 17:11 17 minutes, 11 seconds and uh you know a large part of that growth is uh know being uh fueled by the OTT channel that we have built over the 17:20 17 minutes, 20 seconds last three years. But based on uh the you know current rate we are already at 1,000 cr kind of a rounded OTD. So uh 17:28 17 minutes, 28 seconds know the base has expanded. So from here on what kind of growth rate can we expect uh uh know from the OTT channel 17:36 17 minutes, 36 seconds and in terms of the engagement with uh our existing clients? are we are seeing uh you know the I know the penetration 17:45 17 minutes, 45 seconds in terms of uh is actually coming from the clients or we are getting net new clients on the OTT side and also on the 17:54 17 minutes, 54 seconds enterprise business X of uh OTT uh know like what is the stability that we are 18:03 18 minutes, 3 seconds seeing and you know business which obviously has stabilized but on the domestic piece is it exist existing 18:11 18 minutes, 11 seconds clients are increasing their spend on this on the on the existing channels or the CPAS channels or is there any like newer technologies that we are also 18:19 18 minutes, 19 seconds working on uh in terms of offerings. 18:25 18 minutes, 25 seconds Hi hi Aid Deepak here. Uh so uh firstly uh I would like to say that uh yes uh 18:33 18 minutes, 33 seconds you know the OTT channels are growing uh very fast. WhatsApp is growing very fast and in terms of new channels RCS 18:40 18 minutes, 40 seconds adoption is uh you know is happening uh you know quite fast and uh and even uh 18:48 18 minutes, 48 seconds SMS is also growing in terms of volumes uh because you are aware that uh you know most of the messages which are sent 18:57 18 minutes, 57 seconds are uh mandated by the regulators like RBI and SB and SB and IDA you know all 19:04 19 minutes, 4 seconds the banking alerts UPI alerts you uh you know you are aware of it and so when these uh transactions go up uh you know 19:12 19 minutes, 12 seconds so the volumes also go up uh however they may not be reflecting you know all everything into uh you know higher 19:19 19 minutes, 19 seconds revenues because of uh you know uh there is always a price uh you know uh prices are also a little uh going down on the 19:26 19 minutes, 26 seconds SMS side uh as far as OTT is OTT is opening uh new use cases uh very interesting use 19:35 19 minutes, 35 seconds cases which is actually uh helping us uh engaging retaining our customers and our 19:42 19 minutes, 42 seconds focus was this year to increase our wallet share by offering new use cases by offering uh you know very uh 19:50 19 minutes, 50 seconds interested interesting you know uh journeys to the customers uh and which has really helped us in uh you know 19:58 19 minutes, 58 seconds solidifying our uh you know our our our existing customer base. Other than that we have done uh you know very well in 20:06 20 minutes, 6 seconds acquiring new logos as well. Uh for example we got uh we we won Reserve Bank of India. Okay. So now Reserve Bank of India is very closely working with us. 20:17 20 minutes, 17 seconds We won Bank of Boda which was not there with us is one of the largest bank which were you know were not 20:24 20 minutes, 24 seconds uh there with us. And uh in terms of our existing customers, I I just give you let's say one of the largest uh e-commerce company you know they 20:33 20 minutes, 33 seconds recently you know we were able to increase our increase our uh wallet share uh to more than 50% because they 20:40 20 minutes, 40 seconds started uh you know earlier they were only giving us messaging uh business now they are giving us OTT as well because the kind of uh you know solutions we we 20:49 20 minutes, 49 seconds created for them. So I'm overall uh very happy the way our team has uh you know 20:57 20 minutes, 57 seconds uh has uh you know performed in terms of on the OTT space. Uh you must be aware 21:03 21 minutes, 3 seconds uh that even Meta has uh I mean the last financial year they uh they recognized 21:10 21 minutes, 10 seconds us as the partner of the year for uh for India. Yeah. So that and and and then 21:17 21 minutes, 17 seconds Google you know uh uh uh acknowledged us as a partner of the year. Uh so yeah so 21:24 21 minutes, 24 seconds we are uh we're doing very well on OT space. We are doing very well on on the solutioning side and that is uh helping 21:31 21 minutes, 31 seconds us uh winning new customers as well as increasing our wallet share with the existing customers. Okay. 21:39 21 minutes, 39 seconds And in terms of uh and and you also talk about new technologies. So for the CPA space uh new technologies what we call 21:46 21 minutes, 46 seconds it I mean new channels also which is RCS which is unlocking uh a lot of uh you know possibilities uh for us in terms of 21:55 21 minutes, 55 seconds uh new platforms I mean uh uh you know you know you know Tala keeps coming up with new ideas and new 22:03 22 minutes, 3 seconds platforms so that is helping us let's say for example Bandan Bank we just closed there's one such example which Bundan Bank was working very closely 22:11 22 minutes, 11 seconds with caris for safer services and we are we are able to you know sell our anti-ishing platform as well. Uh 22:18 22 minutes, 18 seconds similarly we we hope to win uh more banks in this financial year and as Uda mentioned you know Tana is working on 22:26 22 minutes, 26 seconds new platforms and uh we are very excited that our enterprise team would be able 22:34 22 minutes, 34 seconds to uh sell these uh uh platforms to our enterprise customers. Okay. 22:42 22 minutes, 42 seconds And also how we are preparing ourselves uh for the technology risk because in the AI world the tech is changing very 22:50 22 minutes, 50 seconds fast and uh know how we are preparing ourselves for that and also you know there is a regulatory kind of not a risk but know regulatory change that could 22:59 22 minutes, 59 seconds also happen where sending SMS will you know like no longer be compulsory. So are we also seeing uh or preparing 23:06 23 minutes, 6 seconds ourselves for such kind of scenario and I know shifting our focus from that because uh what is happening in the voice or the SMS business uh we are 23:15 23 minutes, 15 seconds seeing volumes growth but there is a continuous pricing shrinkage that is happening both from the large banks and also from the you know like government 23:23 23 minutes, 23 seconds uh segment because volumes are coming but it's not actually showing up in both. 23:30 23 minutes, 30 seconds Yeah. So uh yeah please no go ahead go ahead go ahead. Yeah, I mean so uh firstly what I mentioned is I 23:39 23 minutes, 39 seconds mean we we are uh AI native company right TLA is u doing a lot of uh innovations and our platforms are built 23:47 23 minutes, 47 seconds using AI right so we are uh we are very excited with those opportunities and those possibilities so uh so that is 23:56 23 minutes, 56 seconds that on the on the other side what was the other question I follow no 24:03 24 minutes, 3 seconds so uh government uh volumes and banks volumes which is uh 24:10 24 minutes, 10 seconds yeah so you yeah see I hope I'm I see these things I mentioned earlier also it happens and then there is always a reset 24:19 24 minutes, 19 seconds happens uh right uh so we hope soon we would we may see some reset happening over there 24:27 24 minutes, 27 seconds on the prices as well okay so what we expecting Is that the 24:34 24 minutes, 34 seconds prices are actually pointed out or we can see some attributions there in terms of pricing 24:40 24 minutes, 40 seconds it is uh I mean it is on the cards when it will happen I can't say okay 24:48 24 minutes, 48 seconds and what would the mix of uh the government le institutions volume in our overall volume mix if you can know give 24:56 24 minutes, 56 seconds some color on that you mean government govern means central government are are central state government talking about PSU banks and all that. 25:04 25 minutes, 4 seconds Yeah. No, so PSU banks also plus NIC or the you know the government agency, central government agencies. 25:12 25 minutes, 12 seconds See uh the PSU banks is a very uh you know uh good share of our overall volumes and it is growing as you must be 25:20 25 minutes, 20 seconds aware that PSU banks are doing very well in the country today, right? I mean uh 25:27 25 minutes, 27 seconds with the with our kind of focus from the central government and everything and uh we uh manage very uh significantly large 25:37 25 minutes, 37 seconds volumes for PSU banks uh and uh and those volumes are growing 25:44 25 minutes, 44 seconds right on the government side uh we have NIC and then we have some small uh you know other government uh institutions. 25:52 25 minutes, 52 seconds So primarily it is NIC but again uh NIC is a very small uh I mean percentage of our overall business 26:01 26 minutes, 1 second and also um Amit just to add from a uh from the total uh volumes that we do 26:08 26 minutes, 8 seconds with PSUs and government the regulated part of the messages is obviously a small subset of it because we do many more use cases than just the regulated messages. 26:19 26 minutes, 19 seconds Okay. Okay. Okay. And on the on the platform side obviously s we have uh you know been upfront in terms of 26:29 26 minutes, 29 seconds investments and we have know quite a lot uh know good platforms there and we have closed some deals also both in India and internationally but it's not getting 26:37 26 minutes, 37 seconds reflected or it's not getting converted into uh you know the growth numbers as of now. So is it both a timing issue or 26:45 26 minutes, 45 seconds you're seeing some other structural challenges or some kind of challenges there in terms of scaling up and also in terms of the international strategy how 26:54 26 minutes, 54 seconds you're seeing the growth uh know for the next year domestic versus international. 27:04 27 minutes, 4 seconds Correct. 27:05 27 minutes, 5 seconds So it is I mean it is honestly more of a timing issue. There is no structural uh changes or shift happening. It is basically to uh to do with how quickly 27:15 27 minutes, 15 seconds can we replicate our success like we have done with couple of banks in India and abroad. So uh we are obviously accelerating our efforts on the GTM side 27:22 27 minutes, 22 seconds to ensure that the proportion uh becomes higher and and it reflects in the overall performance of the company. So 27:30 27 minutes, 30 seconds it's basically just it's a matter of time that it will start reflecting like that. 27:37 27 minutes, 37 seconds Okay. and the international expansion that uh we invested for the international expansion uh last year. So 27:44 27 minutes, 44 seconds know what kind of growth we can expect from domestic versus international in Yeah. So international actually 27:52 27 minutes, 52 seconds continues to be a significant uh focus area. So I mean our efforts are equally distributed in expanding in India as 27:59 27 minutes, 59 seconds well as other geographies. So it'll a significant portion of growth is going to come from outside India as well. 28:09 28 minutes, 9 seconds Okay. Okay. So sir thanks and all the best. Thank you. 28:15 28 minutes, 15 seconds Thank you. Your next question comes from the line of Deep Ma from MK Global. Please go ahead. 28:22 28 minutes, 22 seconds Yeah thanks for the opportunity. Uh couple of question. First on the FY26 can you provide some sense about volume 28:30 28 minutes, 30 seconds and realization breakout or maybe quarter or whichever way you can provide some sense how it is playing out. Second 28:37 28 minutes, 37 seconds question is on the ATP side entities you said uh the deal which we signed can you provide the earlier two deal how uh that 28:45 28 minutes, 45 seconds has scaled and how it is let's say whether revenue is linked with the number of messages which we block or it is fixed price deal so some control 28:53 28 minutes, 53 seconds around it how generally revenue scale up happen uh third question is about the OTT channel now if I look let's say last 29:00 29 minutes four quarter as a percentage of revenue it largely remains stable around 31 32% percentage each quarter which in a way 29:08 29 minutes, 8 seconds indicate OTT channel growth also moderated to the company average kind of thing. I just want to understand your B thought process whether market has 29:15 29 minutes, 15 seconds stabilized between uh different channel SMS versus other OTT channel and if yes what would be the reason because I 29:23 29 minutes, 23 seconds presume OTT channel should have grown faster. Thank you. 29:28 29 minutes, 28 seconds Yeah. So actually first and third question is linked in a way deb because uh OTT continues to grow faster than 29:35 29 minutes, 35 seconds SMS. Uh however since SMS is more price sensitive in that in that sense. So the so the volumes are growing at a much 29:43 29 minutes, 43 seconds faster pace there is some uh stress on the pricing although it has not declined uh significantly but there is pricing 29:50 29 minutes, 50 seconds pressure. So so prices and so volumes grow faster in OTD. um the correction in price is obviously slower. Uh it is less 29:59 29 minutes, 59 seconds competitive. So overall um we see significant growth in volumes and slight correction in prices. That's the mix of 30:07 30 minutes, 7 seconds price volume. And on the ATP on the second question uh the ATP deals are basically per subscriber per month kind 30:14 30 minutes, 14 seconds of basis. So uh it is not linked with the number of messages blocked. It is actually basically the number of subscribers protected. So that's the model we work with. 30:25 30 minutes, 25 seconds Now just on the first and third which you link on OTT side. Now if let's say SMS is facing pricing pressure then OTT 30:33 30 minutes, 33 seconds shares would have increased right in your case all four quarter OTT say remain flat is 31 32%age kind of thing 30:40 30 minutes, 40 seconds which in a way indicate OTT volume and realization both put together is not showing any different behavior than SMS growth. 30:50 30 minutes, 50 seconds Uh no see I tell you uh see what happens is uh I think uh Anvo also mentioned the 30:56 30 minutes, 56 seconds same thing that uh when we talk about OTT uh so it's primarily uh WhatsApp uh 31:04 31 minutes, 4 seconds which is more than I would say 80% or 90% uh right and RCS is still uh gaining I mean still small uh uh comparatively 31:13 31 minutes, 13 seconds and when we talk about WhatsApp then there are then there are promotional messages and then there are utility messages And the focus uh you know is on uh you 31:23 31 minutes, 23 seconds know so the WhatsApp is growing more on utility and they want to bring down the promotional because of uh customer complaints the user experience is going 31:31 31 minutes, 31 seconds bad and all that you must have seen even your boxes must be getting cluttered with all kind of promotional messages which even matter doesn't want they want 31:39 31 minutes, 39 seconds to bring it down and these these messages are very expensive I mean almost 10 times more expensive compared to your transactional messages or 31:48 31 minutes, 48 seconds utility messages let's say if you you get any information or or any transaction on your WhatsApp right so WhatsApp wants to grow those messages 31:56 31 minutes, 56 seconds and bring and bring the volume down for marketing so even though the volumes are growing but it may not be reflecting in 32:04 32 minutes, 4 seconds the revenues or the revenue growth per se I understand and that is what my bigger question was whether now market is 32:12 32 minutes, 12 seconds stabilizing because the way you are indicating because of the mix change between promotional and utility messages blended realization might have come down 32:19 32 minutes, 19 seconds for WhatsApp messages which is reflected in despite higher volume growth or lower blended realization giving you flat is kind of similar growth at company 32:27 32 minutes, 27 seconds average do you think this would be the now stabilized kind of market which in a way indicate OTT channel growth will 32:34 32 minutes, 34 seconds converge with overall market growth uh okay so it's like this uh uh we 32:42 32 minutes, 42 seconds operate uh let's say when I talk about our enterprise business so Our enterprise 32:48 32 minutes, 48 seconds business happen like about 75 to 80% business happening for the top 250 customers let's say right uh and then 32:56 32 minutes, 56 seconds you have a long tail from where your 50 20% business coming from another 50 60,000 enterprises so this is how the Cass market is tagged and uh as far we 33:06 33 minutes, 6 seconds are concerned we we are there in almost 80% of these customers we are present and now we are we trying to increase our wallet share having said that now when 33:14 33 minutes, 14 seconds we talk about portity I mean you would see that uh WhatsApp still growing uh year on year. The growth is very very 33:21 33 minutes, 21 seconds high because they are venturing into theme market. So they are target maybe a 33:28 33 minutes, 28 seconds 2 millionmemes in the country where currently we are not operating right. So where we are 33:36 33 minutes, 36 seconds operating yes you are right that it is very well stabilized but then there's another huge market uh where you know 33:44 33 minutes, 44 seconds they have small t they call it tsps technology service providers and all that okay who are there in every city every small little city and providing 33:52 33 minutes, 52 seconds services to let's say some salon some grocery store or some you know uh could be any housing society and all of that 34:00 34 minutes so that's a very different market altogether where uh the growth is very very 34:07 34 minutes, 7 seconds Understood. But but from Tandla or enterprise market perspective, this is like now seeing some kind of stability OTT channel growth that is right way to understand. 34:17 34 minutes, 17 seconds Yes. 34:18 34 minutes, 18 seconds Okay. Last question is about the reason for delay in uh closure of value first international because now almost 3 years now. Can you provide some sense what is 34:27 34 minutes, 27 seconds leading to uh this delay? 34:32 34 minutes, 32 seconds Dep the reason actually continues to be the same. Uh we are still coordinating with the regulatory authority there to 34:40 34 minutes, 40 seconds uh obviously fast track it as much as possible and we are also looking at alternate uh any alternate if it is possible because it has caused 34:47 34 minutes, 47 seconds significant delays. So we are now also evaluating if there are any other ways to um to consolidate consolidate those 34:55 34 minutes, 55 seconds businesses because it's been a long time. So actually working on both sides in the sense that alternate approach as well as expediting approvals from RBI. 35:06 35 minutes, 6 seconds Sir I'm not very clear what are the reasons? Uh you said it is regulatory approach but let's say where it get stuck. 35:14 35 minutes, 14 seconds No it is it is stuck at the RBI level because there are some old matters which had to be uh clarified etc. There is 35:22 35 minutes, 22 seconds documentation going on with RBI question set of questions being asked etc. So uh that's where it is currently. Uh that's where we are currently. 35:33 35 minutes, 33 seconds Okay. Thank you. 35:36 35 minutes, 36 seconds Thank you. Your next question comes from the line of Sarat Kohli an individual investor. Please go ahead. 35:43 35 minutes, 43 seconds Yeah. Hi. Um I have a few questions. Uh the first question is can you give us some because there's never been any u 35:51 35 minutes, 51 seconds deep disclosure on what makes up the platform business and recently that you guys signed the Indoad and I think from the last conference call you mentioned 36:00 36 minutes that it's for entire subscriber base which is $100 million sorry which is 100 million subscribers um can you give some 36:07 36 minutes, 7 seconds sense as to on a yearly basis you charge 10 rupees 20 rupees 30 rupees per subscriber so it's easy for us to kind 36:14 36 minutes, 14 seconds of at least project some kind of growth of the of the 400 uh cr business that you have on the platform side. That's my 36:21 36 minutes, 21 seconds first question and similarly if you can just give a broad outline on how much do you collect per user on the on the 36:28 36 minutes, 28 seconds banking side for the uh ATP product. Uh those are my questions on that and then I know this uh UAE thing has been taking 36:36 36 minutes, 36 seconds a while but when you made the acquisition first I think you had given a broad um I'd asked that question then I think the answer you gave was that the 36:44 36 minutes, 44 seconds business when you acquired value first the the UA subsidy was about 200 crores of topline and singledigit gross margin. 36:52 36 minutes, 52 seconds Um can you give us some uh kind of guidance on on where that 200 crores has gone whether it is um become 300 crores 37:01 37 minutes, 1 second 400 crores and I know that you guys uh once you acquire someone um you kind of expand the margin so it'll be helpful to 37:10 37 minutes, 10 seconds understand that that low singledigit gross margin has that gone to double digits or not? Uh and then a final 37:17 37 minutes, 17 seconds question uh is just a more broader picture at the board level. Um, do you guys have a sense of when you might be 37:25 37 minutes, 25 seconds thinking of uh splitting and this is not an immediate question but I mean it's a question I'm asking now but it's not an immediate event but are there any 37:33 37 minutes, 33 seconds thoughts in terms of saying that now that the platform business gross margin is half it's about 100 plus crores half of the enterprise business um the Indian 37:42 37 minutes, 42 seconds markets clearly are not valuing that business and we have examples of uh companies listed in the US and Europe 37:49 37 minutes, 49 seconds which derive a much higher multiple Uh is there any thought saying that okay once we get to a a 300 cr or 400 cr gross margin business on the platform 37:57 37 minutes, 57 seconds side we will look to look to split this companies and list that in a different market. Those are my questions. 38:16 38 minutes, 16 seconds Uh sorry to interrupt. Uh satir the line for the management has been dropped. Uh just please stay connected while we reconnect the line to the management. 38:26 38 minutes, 26 seconds Okay. 39:31 39 minutes, 31 seconds Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for staying connected. We have the line for the management reconnected. Uh, please go ahead. Yes. Okay. Um Sh. 39:42 39 minutes, 42 seconds Yeah, I'm here. Thanks. 39:45 39 minutes, 45 seconds Sh let me start with the last question first like you know so we don't have any such plans but but our top focus is to 39:53 39 minutes, 53 seconds to to grow the top sorry platform um margins to revenues um uh as fast as we 40:02 40 minutes, 2 seconds can. Um we're also expecting a a good growth this this year though I'm I'm not in a position to share uh anything 40:09 40 minutes, 9 seconds beyond that but but uh we we are pretty much focused opportunities are very big as you know like you know we had the first deployment with Indoat which is 40:17 40 minutes, 17 seconds outside India that platform is doing phenomenal job um so so so we we are investing outside India we in fact we 40:25 40 minutes, 25 seconds are we are good in the people outside India first time um so yeah but but we don't have any intention to get listed outside India right now. So that's 40:34 40 minutes, 34 seconds number one. And when it comes to indoors, both the platform.ai and Wisely ATP which is deployed in India like know they get paid per user per month. Okay. 40:45 40 minutes, 45 seconds So that's how it works like it's more of subscription model and they're all long-term deals. Um uh if I'm allowed to 40:51 40 minutes, 51 seconds say uh we closed with three banks uh in India on the ATP. Um they're all I think if I remember correctly like it's all 40:59 40 minutes, 59 seconds long-term deals which are around 5 years deals and same uh same with Indoac it's a pretty long long-term deals 41:07 41 minutes, 7 seconds subscription model uh whenever they add the subscribers uh we get paid for that subscriber from that month. So that's how that's how it works. 41:17 41 minutes, 17 seconds No I understand that. I was just wondering because there's no uh breakdown between true block and ATP and this uh Indoad deal on the 400 crores of 41:27 41 minutes, 27 seconds platform business. I was trying to understand from a modeling perspective if you could just give some guidance it's 100 million times 10 rupees or 20 41:34 41 minutes, 34 seconds rupees per subscriber. So you know I can just say okay rough I can do some rough estimation saying 100 million times 10 rupees it's 100 crores per year on 41:43 41 minutes, 43 seconds Indoad. Is there anything you can help with that? 41:45 41 minutes, 45 seconds Um not right now shar probably next quarter. Next quarter. 41:50 41 minutes, 50 seconds Okay. And then on the on the UAE side um I don't know if you heard that question but my question was 41:59 41 minutes, 59 seconds yes yes on on the on the UAE side like you know as I think has given the reasons why it got delayed. uh but uh I 42:07 42 minutes, 7 seconds think we had very extensive discussion in the board meeting uh last last week and um uh I think we asked our 42:14 42 minutes, 14 seconds consultants to look at uh different options uh legal options right and I I think we should able to see some light 42:21 42 minutes, 21 seconds in in in this water that that's what uh we kind of realized last week so uh that's number one and effectively we 42:29 42 minutes, 29 seconds should able to close a deal in this water let me let me let me commit that that's number one number two Um 42:36 42 minutes, 36 seconds uh yes in terms of the margins I think our car team is is uh is helping them to increase the margins which I think they 42:44 42 minutes, 44 seconds have grown from from I think to to almost 20 22% gross margin. Um but in terms of topline I think uh they still 42:52 42 minutes, 52 seconds around 150 to 170 crores as you as we speak peranom. uh but it's question of u once we once we transfer this business 43:01 43 minutes, 1 second to our teams outside India um I mean you you see the ma you see the magic so let me commit that we will we will close uh 43:10 43 minutes, 10 seconds the well first international this quarter um probably effectively around 150 to 170 quotes top with around 22% 43:18 43 minutes, 18 seconds gross margin is going to add to this to this financial year that's that's good to hear so you guys have basically expanded your margin by 43:27 43 minutes, 27 seconds almost doubled your margin. So that's great to hear. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thanks. Yeah. Thank you. 43:35 43 minutes, 35 seconds Your next question comes from the line of Amit Agarwal from Leeway Investments. Please go ahead. 43:42 43 minutes, 42 seconds Uh good afternoon sir. There was an article in the newspaper regarding that uh UK transactions will be will do away with 43:49 43 minutes, 49 seconds uh SMS notifications. how much business will be affective uh affected because of that uh development. And my second 43:57 43 minutes, 57 seconds question is uh uh more and more uh bigger companies are going for uh in-house uh inapp notifications as they are cost 44:05 44 minutes, 5 seconds effective. How much business uh so what so what is the future of uh our SMS and uh WhatsApp notifications because bigger 44:13 44 minutes, 13 seconds companies are going for inapp uh inapp notifications. These are my two questions. 44:20 44 minutes, 20 seconds Um so Amit uh like we mentioned in the earlier question as well we do a lot of use cases for PSU and um other 44:27 44 minutes, 27 seconds government banks but other government organizations but honestly regulated I would say there there would be an impact but it's a singledigit percentage of our 44:35 44 minutes, 35 seconds overall uh volumes that we do which which fall under the strictly regulated kind of messages. So uh and there are 44:43 44 minutes, 43 seconds there would be alternate methods of doing that communication and we are obviously building enhancing our product portfolio to ensure if there is any 44:50 44 minutes, 50 seconds other way of authenticating the users we also kind of participate in that uh channel for example there could be network APIs etc from uh from telos 44:59 44 minutes, 59 seconds which can be used as alternate so uh that that is on the regulated messages and on inapp notification honestly it's 45:06 45 minutes, 6 seconds not a new way of connecting with the user it has been there for many many years now but the kind of use cases we 45:13 45 minutes, 13 seconds do on u on on OTT and other SMS uh channels it is much more engaging in 45:20 45 minutes, 20 seconds nature so I think in inapp notification will not have significant impact because it has not had significant impact on the business so I we don't think that there 45:28 45 minutes, 28 seconds will be a there will be any there will be any impact there because of inapp notification and because uh my worry is uh companies 45:36 45 minutes, 36 seconds like blinket and which are the biggest growing E-commerce companies they hardly use our system I suppose am I right? 45:45 45 minutes, 45 seconds Yeah, they already use. 45:47 45 minutes, 47 seconds Yeah. No. So, so here I I tell you uh firstly uh both are our customers uh Zmetto as well as Swiggy. Okay. They 45:56 45 minutes, 56 seconds both are number one. Number two uh so you see the difference why uh they don't you may not be getting too much of SMS notifications when you order a food. 46:06 46 minutes, 6 seconds Yes. 46:07 46 minutes, 7 seconds Right. Or you order anything. The reason being because this is a very very unique case over here that that that you you you pick up your phone, you order your 46:16 46 minutes, 16 seconds food that time your eyes are very much there you know and then and there the deal gets closed okay and you you get to know that you know your your order is 46:24 46 minutes, 24 seconds accepted everything is happen in within the app itself okay so there nothing much is there right but let's say uh if if you look at 46:33 46 minutes, 33 seconds those till Zomemetto does and lot of other use cases over there but if you if you let's say look But if you order from Flipkart, okay, 46:41 46 minutes, 41 seconds so and so the delivery takes about 4 days, 6 days, whatever. So you will get a message, hey, your order is accepted. 46:48 46 minutes, 48 seconds That you you will see in your app, but next day you will get a message that your order is on the way. Uh be ready for the delivery. Here is your OTP. 46:57 46 minutes, 57 seconds Okay, then then you get another message is delivered. So all those then those would be sent by via SMS or via WhatsApp, right? because very because that time you are not in your app. 47:09 47 minutes, 9 seconds No, but uh blinket blinket so there's not much uses in blinket I suppose right is that right? 47:17 47 minutes, 17 seconds So, so for the certain use case as I said for certain uh you know cases the use is less but that is there for it's 47:25 47 minutes, 25 seconds not that it has come down now it is always like that let's say even for when you book Ola or U over cabs right again you are you are very much there in the 47:34 47 minutes, 34 seconds app and it is getting the entire journey is getting completed then and there okay that is a different kind of use case 47:41 47 minutes, 41 seconds altogether you are not you you know when you come out of the app everything is Right? You don't need any other confirmations or anything. So, so that 47:50 47 minutes, 50 seconds is a very future as as far as I understand that in in the future we should be more dependent on the smaller enterprises rather than the 47:58 47 minutes, 58 seconds very big enterprises because they have no no it is not no it is not about small or big enterprises here I'm talking 48:05 48 minutes, 5 seconds about very very few unique cases where you can say call about quick commerce or let's say you you talk about those uh 48:12 48 minutes, 12 seconds you know cars and all otherwise uh you know you look at large uh I mean you look at flip card. Look at Amazon. Look at Myntra. Look at Nika. 48:23 48 minutes, 23 seconds Okay. 48:23 48 minutes, 23 seconds Uh Misho, right? Big basket. 48:27 48 minutes, 27 seconds They all are customers. They all are uh and their number of transactions are going up and your our transactions are going up along with them. 48:37 48 minutes, 37 seconds Right. 48:37 48 minutes, 37 seconds Okay. And my uh my question is how much uh business are we going to lose because of UPI uh is doing away with uh SMS notifications in the future. 48:49 48 minutes, 49 seconds I mean UPS doing away SMS notifications I I'm I'm not aware of because it came in the newspaper just uh I think in the month of February. 48:59 48 minutes, 59 seconds No no you must be talking about the silent authentication for OTPs. 49:04 49 minutes, 4 seconds No, no, I'm talking about the up UP notation that uh you know 100 rs has been sent to you or 5,000 piece has been sent to you whatever 49:12 49 minutes, 12 seconds that's not changing. I think uh Amit I think it is about it is to do with the value of less than let's say u we're 49:22 49 minutes, 22 seconds talking about a particular denomination if you send less than that money then and currently also there is no UPN notification on SMS 49:29 49 minutes, 29 seconds no that I think that that we discussed two or three conferences back but there was a news article I can send it to you next time maybe we can discuss next time 49:37 49 minutes, 37 seconds there was an article that they are doing I tell you so I tell you lot of banks they have their own rules Okay. And they are uh you know RBI is also flexible 49:45 49 minutes, 45 seconds about it where certain banks they say that we will not send notification for less than 100 rupees that's going on for for you know multiple years now for two 49:53 49 minutes, 53 seconds three years back you know banks have adopted certain things right as some banks say we will not send any notification for less than 500 rupees 49:59 49 minutes, 59 seconds that's already in uh but how much business we get from UPI are you able to disclose that 50:09 50 minutes, 9 seconds sorry how much business are we getting from UP? Yeah. 50:13 50 minutes, 13 seconds No, we will not be able to call out that number. 50:18 50 minutes, 18 seconds And my second question is regarding uh like uh uh Indonesian deal. Uh how many telco can we expect in next two three 50:25 50 minutes, 25 seconds years? Is it difficult to uh because there are hundred of telecom companies around the world. So how much difficult is to crack some more telecom companies around the world? 50:36 50 minutes, 36 seconds So Amit the sales cycle is long but obviously like you mentioned the universe is humongous. So we are actually uh gunning for as much as 50:44 50 minutes, 44 seconds acquisition of telco clients as as possible. We can't give a number as such but obviously uh uh the the pipeline is 50:52 50 minutes, 52 seconds huge and the opportunity is huge and we want to convert it as okay thank you thank you Dr. 50:59 50 minutes, 59 seconds you thank you so much thank you ladies and gentlemen we will take that as our last question for today I now 51:07 51 minutes, 7 seconds hand the conflicts over to Mr. Ma for closing comments. 51:11 51 minutes, 11 seconds Uh thank you everybody for joining. In case we could not answer your calls, answer your questions, please reach out to investor health desk. We'll be happy to answer. Thank you. Good evening. 51:23 51 minutes, 23 seconds Thank you on behalf of Tanla Platforms Limited. That concludes this conference. 51:28 51 minutes, 28 seconds Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.