Jindal Saw Limited — Q4 FY26

Jindal SAW Ltd Q4 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAEXPZUjBOI Published: 2 weeks ago

0:01 1 second Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Jindel Saw Limited Q4 FY26 earnings conference call hosted by 0:10 10 seconds ICICI Securities Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an 0:19 19 seconds opportunity for you to ask question after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistant during the conference 0:26 26 seconds call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this 0:33 33 seconds conference has been recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vikas Singh from ICICI securities limited. Thank you and over to you. 0:45 45 seconds Good afternoon everyone. A warm welcome to Q4 FI26 Ginder conference call from the management side. We have with us Mr. 0:53 53 seconds Narendra, Chief Operating and Financial Officer, Mr. Vin Kumar, President and Head Treasury and Mr. Rajiv Goya, senior vice president, corporate finance. 1:04 1 minute, 4 seconds Without taking any much time, I'll hand it over to Mr. Mantri for his opinion and remark. Over to you, sir. 1:12 1 minute, 12 seconds Yeah. Hi, this is uh Mr. Mantri would take up the question. So, I'm I'm Vin Gupta. So, let me give the uh preface 1:20 1 minute, 20 seconds and uh Raji Mr. monthly all speaking together we would be addressing uh the questions of the uh participant. So if it is okay can I start? 1:32 1 minute, 32 seconds Yes sir. 1:33 1 minute, 33 seconds Okay fine. Uh so good afternoon everyone and welcome to the general stores FI26 earnings call. I'm Vupa from Jindal. We 1:43 1 minute, 43 seconds like to extend our thanks to the IC direct team for organizing this session and facilitating their discussions. 1:50 1 minute, 50 seconds The board of directors approved the audited financial results for 2026 on April 27th, 2026 which has since been 1:59 1 minute, 59 seconds filed with changes. We trust you have reviewed these documents. Now let me present uh the highlights 2:08 2 minutes, 8 seconds and of the financials and some brief about that. So first of all performance 2:15 2 minutes, 15 seconds in Q3 improved relative to the immediate previous quarter of FI26 and we expected and we mentioned in last 2:24 2 minutes, 24 seconds call that Q4 is expected to be better than Q3. This is what we mentioned um on 2:31 2 minutes, 31 seconds the call for Q3. On the contrary, the performance of Q4 of FI26 dropped across if compared with the previous quarter which is Q3. 2:42 2 minutes, 42 seconds Performance of FI 26 also dropped as compared to FI25. 2:49 2 minutes, 49 seconds Now before we go to progresses and what is happening, let me very quickly cover the numbers the highlight numbers of 2:57 2 minutes, 57 seconds standalone consolidated quarter and full year. So for u uh for the financial year 3:06 3 minutes, 6 seconds uh on a standalone basis the company registered a total income of 3,852 3:15 3 minutes, 15 seconds crores uh representing a decline over Q3 FI26 by approximately 7%. 3:27 3 minutes, 27 seconds A bit for Q4 FI26 to that rupees 413 cr showcasing a decline over Q3 FI26 which 3:35 3 minutes, 35 seconds was 527 cr rupees representing a decline of 22 crores care for Q4 is reported at 3:42 3 minutes, 42 seconds rupees 114 cr showing a decline over Q3 FI26 uh which are 227 which represents a decline of 50%. 3:55 3 minutes, 55 seconds On consolidated basis for the quarter four the total income stood at 4657 cr as compared to rupees 4:04 4 minutes, 4 seconds 4963 cr in Q4 f26 representing a decline of 6%. A bit 4:11 4 minutes, 11 seconds stood at 54 cr showcasing a decline over Q3 uh which was 632 cr was a decline of 4:18 4 minutes, 18 seconds 20%. Cash for Q4 FA26 is reported 124 cr showing a decline of uh decline over 4:26 4 minutes, 26 seconds Q326 which are 248 cr representing decline of 50%. 4:32 4 minutes, 32 seconds Uh now let's talk about the full year FI 26 and FI25. 4:37 4 minutes, 37 seconds On standalone basis the company registered total income of approximately Rs 14,745 cr representing a decline 4:46 4 minutes, 46 seconds uh of approximately 19% as compared to FI25 where the total income was 18,178 cr rupes. The VITA for FI26 4:56 4 minutes, 56 seconds uh is rupes 1835 cr rupes as compared to 3,456 cr rupes for the previous year representing a decline of 47%. 5:06 5 minutes, 6 seconds T for f26 is reported at rups 784 cr against 1874 cr decline show 5:13 5 minutes, 13 seconds representing decline of 58%. On consolidated basis the uh total company 5:21 5 minutes, 21 seconds registered a personal income of approximately 17987 cr as compared to 20,948 cr rupes representing 5:29 5 minutes, 29 seconds approximately 14% decline. VITA for 26 is 236 cr as compared to 3548 5:39 5 minutes, 39 seconds cr of the previous year showing a decline of 35%. 5:43 5 minutes, 43 seconds Patch for FI26 is 48 925 cr against 1458 cr rupees representing a decline of 37%. 5:51 5 minutes, 51 seconds In terms of our indebtedness as on 31st March 2026 complete standalone net debt 6:00 6 minutes reduced to rupees 25 453 cr as compared to rups 3,154 cr uh uh on the previous 6:10 6 minutes, 10 seconds year and uh this includes long-term debt of 529 cr only. 6:17 6 minutes, 17 seconds Next institutional debt on console basis has reduced to rupes 2528 cr as compared 6:24 6 minutes, 24 seconds to rups 3346 cr which was on 31th December 25. Long-term debt on 31st March uh was rupees 692 cr only. So debt 6:34 6 minutes, 34 seconds profile of the company remains robust uh despite uh the business volatility. Now the premises for the results are number 6:43 6 minutes, 43 seconds one Q for an FI26 or decline in overall scale primarily driven by weakness in the ductile pipe segment amid ongoing water infrastructure sector challenges. 6:55 6 minutes, 55 seconds Despite positive policy announcements under the Jian mission project execution on ground remains sluggish impacting our 7:04 7 minutes, 4 seconds total waterfight business during FI 26. 7:09 7 minutes, 9 seconds Despite a robust export of the book including six lakh metric ton of job contract from Saudi Arabia, all export 7:17 7 minutes, 17 seconds shipments have been suspended since March 26. This is due to the activation 7:24 7 minutes, 24 seconds of the force major clauses uh following the outbreak of the military conflict in the Mina region. So no shipment uh has gone from 1st of March 2026. 7:35 7 minutes, 35 seconds Export business typically yields higher margin uh as compared to domestic. The the deferment of all the planned export 7:42 7 minutes, 42 seconds shipments to Mina region of all kinds of types in March 26 resulted in lower Q4 7:49 7 minutes, 49 seconds profitability as compared to Q3 missing our original expectations. This will get 7:55 7 minutes, 55 seconds reflected in 2627 once uh the shipments will start. So this is basically a deferment or post forment on the time scale. 8:05 8 minutes, 5 seconds Company also reported a 48 cr rupees foreign exchange cost during this quarter following the revaluation of US 8:13 8 minutes, 13 seconds dollar denominated exposures. This was driven by the rupees sharp decline over the quarter. It fell from 88.88 8:23 8 minutes, 23 seconds rupees per dollar to 94.84 rupees per dollar. So this is perhaps one of the quarters in the last so many 8:31 8 minutes, 31 seconds years uh reflecting a depreciation of more than 5. 8:39 8 minutes, 39 seconds Now some update on our carbon seamless pipe segment. On February 26 15 February 8:47 8 minutes, 47 seconds 26 we reported to Shinjis about developments in our carbon seamless 8:53 8 minutes, 53 seconds product. It was reported following an API audit nonconformances were identified. A suspension letter was 9:02 9 minutes, 2 seconds issued permitting the use of the EK monogram monogram on our teamless sites. 9:08 9 minutes, 8 seconds All requested data has since been presented to API authorities within the specified time frame time time frame. 9:15 9 minutes, 15 seconds All NC's have been formally addressed and closed as per the requirements of API authorities. Auditors appointed by 9:23 9 minutes, 23 seconds API authorities are scheduled to revisit our factory in Nasi uh in May 2026 for verification. 9:32 9 minutes, 32 seconds Following this, the final approval to use the AK monogram on seamless site is expected in due course. Given this 9:40 9 minutes, 40 seconds providing a specific timeline for approval at this stage would be very speculative and due to this regulatory 9:47 9 minutes, 47 seconds timeline we anticipate a temporary impact on our sale of API seamless 9:54 9 minutes, 54 seconds pipes. But to mitigate the impact, the company is leveraging flexible manufacturing capability. Flexible manufacturing capabilities to relocate 10:03 10 minutes, 3 seconds production towards alternative CMS PI products to minimize the loss on account of the overall volume business. 10:12 10 minutes, 12 seconds Profitability in EPI business typically is comparatively better than the non-EP business. 10:20 10 minutes, 20 seconds Now the Mina region has impacted all the businesses who are getting to Mina region or any insure outflow to that uh 10:29 10 minutes, 29 seconds region and uh we would like to address that point also. Now you know like following escalation of conflict in the 10:36 10 minutes, 36 seconds Mina region starting 28th February 2026 we're experiencing severe logistic disruption including non-avity of 10:45 10 minutes, 45 seconds vessels consequently all shipments from India and Abu Dhabi facilities in Middle East are suspended until further notice 10:53 10 minutes, 53 seconds and further until safety conditions allow for safe passage. Abu Dhabi plant sales are restricted to customers in the 11:02 11 minutes, 2 seconds countries which are within the trucking range. So we are continuing the business but wherever the trucks can go but where the ships have to go that business is 11:11 11 minutes, 11 seconds comp temporarily suspended. The impacted Q4 and FI25 26 and profitability at 11:19 11 minutes, 19 seconds standard and console level and where the revenue recognition is deferred to 2627. 11:27 11 minutes, 27 seconds Now this ongoing crisis in Mina region has necessitated a static shift towards 11:35 11 minutes, 35 seconds securing energy infrastructure generating new opportunities for pipeline extension repair and 11:41 11 minutes, 41 seconds replacement particularly for projects designed to bypass volatile maritime choke points. This transition is 11:50 11 minutes, 50 seconds accelerating investments in infrastructure that bypasses high-risk areas offering substantial opportunities for pipe manufacturing and EPC 11:58 11 minutes, 58 seconds providers. We expect the country's immunization to invest significantly in the replacement and new pipeline infrastructure for oil, gas and water. 12:09 12 minutes, 9 seconds Similarly, India will also need to invest significantly to work on energy security. We may expect new pipelines 12:17 12 minutes, 17 seconds requirements in the next couple of months. In March 26, the government has issued a landmark order to fasttrack pipes gas roll out across the country. 12:27 12 minutes, 27 seconds Bureaucratic delays, excessive charges and local bottlenecks that once showed or projects are now being swept aside 12:36 12 minutes, 36 seconds and timebound approvals and decision center backing. Apart from this, OMGC has also announced in March 26 deep 12:43 12 minutes, 43 seconds water exploration project of approximately $20 billion. Now what is there for us in all of this? 12:53 12 minutes, 53 seconds While conflict in Mina region present significant challenges, the resulting shifts are creating new avenues for 13:00 13 minutes growth. Zinda soil actively capitalizing on these emerging opportunities through strategic expansions and local manufacturing in the region itself. 13:10 13 minutes, 10 seconds As you know company has already announced it investments plans to set up a carbon steel pipe plant in Abu Dhabi through a subsidiary. There are good 13:20 13 minutes, 20 seconds developments in the project. A developed piece of land with some civil infrastructure has already been secured. 13:27 13 minutes, 27 seconds Ordering for equipment with advanced payments and opening of LCS has started. 13:31 13 minutes, 31 seconds Project company has signed long-term lease agreement with uh AD port for land parcel in Saudi Arabia. Company established a 13:39 13 minutes, 39 seconds youngster company with its investments of 51% and balance 49% is buying uh BH 13:46 13 minutes, 46 seconds group uh in KSA. This JV will set up a ELSA and ESA facility. 13:53 13 minutes, 53 seconds Land for one of the project has already been secured. LT has been established for fuel shipments. Our end will now be 14:00 14 minutes to set up all these plants in Abu Dhabi in case on first track basis. Now let us discuss couple of other matters 14:09 14 minutes, 9 seconds including subsidies and join ventures in UEI. The regional conflicts in Mina regions have disrupted the operations of 14:17 14 minutes, 17 seconds the Abu Dhabi facilities. Also the facility remains in a highly impacted 14:24 14 minutes, 24 seconds area. in this region. Due to these circumstances and with employee safety as our top priority, operations have been reduced to meet essential demand. 14:34 14 minutes, 34 seconds The sales from Abu Dhabi plant are restricted to customers which could be served from the truck. In this backdrop 14:42 14 minutes, 42 seconds in Q4 of F26, Abu Dhabi company delivered approximately 48,000 ton pipes as compared to 52,000 ton in Q3. 14:53 14 minutes, 53 seconds And uh as of March 31st, 2026, the subs will be hold book approximately $180 14:59 14 minutes, 59 seconds million which is close to 170 $171,000 metric ton giving a visibility of approximately 9 months of operations and 15:09 15 minutes, 9 seconds uh this is independent of the outer book of uh jind saw limited in joint in general uh hunting joint venture. It is 15:18 15 minutes, 18 seconds joint venture where Zinder has 511% and hunting has 49%. We generated a revenue 15:25 15 minutes, 25 seconds of approximately 149 cr with 49 43.2 cr of a pet. This is bit lower as compared 15:33 15 minutes, 33 seconds to previous year where the top line was 177 cr and 51.5 cr was the pet in FI25. 15:41 15 minutes, 41 seconds In case of our ongoing litigation uh with NTPC, the matter is moving 15:49 15 minutes, 49 seconds uh uh matter moving with NTPC uh in Delhi High Court at double bench. 15:56 15 minutes, 56 seconds Majority of the arguments by both the parties are completed. There may be one or two more uh dates before the court reserves its order. 16:07 16 minutes, 7 seconds So now with this backdrop before I conclude this presentation let me summarize that Q4 FI26 performance did 16:15 16 minutes, 15 seconds not meet our expectation of exceeding Q3 uh results primarily due to mention reasons we mentioned above 16:24 16 minutes, 24 seconds factors contributing to Q4 muted performance persist and we expect 16:31 16 minutes, 31 seconds its impact on Q1 results of the current year also if situation improve The we we 16:38 16 minutes, 38 seconds are we have capability uh to ramp up the business very quickly. But as of now as we speak uh this quarter at least few 16:48 16 minutes, 48 seconds more weeks or few couple of uh sometime looks to be uh getting impacted improved 16:55 16 minutes, 55 seconds conditions in Mina region will enable the company to rapidly accelerate export shipments because our order book comprise of roughly 29 to 30% export to 17:04 17 minutes, 4 seconds Mina region lot of shipments are on hold we would try to push as much as possible but immediately the shipments will 17:12 17 minutes, 12 seconds There is a announcement by the government relating to Jelju mission uh with allocation cabinet approval and 17:19 17 minutes, 19 seconds funds uh getting released by the center to stay gradually. This will revive the part of waterf business uh where the tip 17:29 17 minutes, 29 seconds business would take the lead and this will be helpful for the operations of the company in the industry as a whole. 17:35 17 minutes, 35 seconds Complete new initiatives in Abu Dhabi for seamless project and in Saudi for projects are expected to yield good 17:42 17 minutes, 42 seconds results once these uh plants are set up and become operational. 17:48 17 minutes, 48 seconds In today's volatile time, our high liquidity provides a critical buffer with a deliberate balance sheet and a 17:56 17 minutes, 56 seconds strong working capital uh lines available with the banking system. We are well positioned to fund future growth. 18:04 18 minutes, 4 seconds We have made capital expenditures across our Indian facilities to drive growth. 18:09 18 minutes, 9 seconds [music] 18:09 18 minutes, 9 seconds These expenditures focuses on debuting, enhancing operation efficiency and providing infrastructure to our staff at the plants. 18:21 18 minutes, 21 seconds Now to end this presentation, we would still like to add one more line that we are witnessing unprecedented time. 18:31 18 minutes, 31 seconds where projecting the business for future is very unpredictable. 18:37 18 minutes, 37 seconds The management is taking all possible steps to safeguard its interest and see 18:44 18 minutes, 44 seconds how best we can ramp up the operations and business in domestic market pending the export markets opens up. With this 18:52 18 minutes, 52 seconds note, let me uh uh request if there is a question, we open the floor for the question and answer. 19:10 19 minutes, 10 seconds Please start the Q&A. Thank you, sir. 19:16 19 minutes, 16 seconds Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask question may press star and one on your touchstone telephone. If 19:25 19 minutes, 25 seconds you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handset while asking a question. 19:35 19 minutes, 35 seconds Ladies and gentlemen will wait for a moment while the question Q assemble. 19:42 19 minutes, 42 seconds The first question is from the line of Danjay Bhagatia from Aluki. Please go ahead. 19:51 19 minutes, 51 seconds Hello. So firstly congratulations on a good set of numbers and tough environment. Uh I just wanted to ask you how are we getting feelers from uh these 20:00 20 minutes other regions? Are we or demand? Are we seeing much more volume uptake let's say in FI27 any like numbers we can think of? 20:11 20 minutes, 11 seconds Yeah. Hi Dan. This is Vinadupta. So at this point of time the interaction with uh if you're talking about the export 20:19 20 minutes, 19 seconds business if you're talking about the main region the interaction with the lot of customers is not happening on 20:27 20 minutes, 27 seconds facetoface basis what we are trying to accumulate the information and intelligences from the 20:34 20 minutes, 34 seconds public uh let's say uh public bas public platforms and uh public media we of course since 20:42 20 minutes, 42 seconds we now have presence in Saudi and Abu Dhabi. We are our people are trying to get some sense from various stakeholders 20:51 20 minutes, 51 seconds including the oil and gas companies there that how they uh are proceeding how they want to go forward. But having 20:59 20 minutes, 59 seconds said all this there are if if you're tracking there are lot of media news where the project which were in the cold 21:06 21 minutes, 6 seconds stoages the projects which were stuck for whatever reasons they there's the urgency to push those projects. So I'm not think that will come overnight but 21:14 21 minutes, 14 seconds uh uh they would cut short the timelines and there will be agency in doing this. 21:20 21 minutes, 20 seconds So so that like if if this stalemate converts into the stalemate of Ukraine Russia then what is going to happen? So 21:29 21 minutes, 29 seconds eventually there would be some urgency now in the in in the in the region and uh that would be helpful and that would be beneficial for the industry as such. 21:39 21 minutes, 39 seconds And what about India? How is the internet demand? How we seeing that coming on? 21:44 21 minutes, 44 seconds So India water demand remains the only thing the water business 21:51 21 minutes, 51 seconds mission. So Jan mission give right to another kind of let's say business opportunity where the state governments are arranging the funds and state 21:59 21 minutes, 59 seconds governments are giving the orders. So this is independent of Jan. So the the whatever business has happened in the 22:06 22 minutes, 6 seconds sense of fund release from the Zen was on on account of state uh that is bit competitive but we expect that the the 22:15 22 minutes, 15 seconds macro level demand has not died down macro level demand remains the same. It is only deferment. Hopefully this year 22:22 22 minutes, 22 seconds the business should pick up and uh the industry should respond very quickly. So everybody has a capacity, everybody has 22:30 22 minutes, 30 seconds order book. We are gearing up. We in fact our fourth quarter sale is completely better than the QC sale for uh worker business. 22:38 22 minutes, 38 seconds Sure. And so uh with steel prices going up as they are, do we do we think we'll have a hit by inflation or will we pass it on on margin? 22:50 22 minutes, 50 seconds See we don't we don't accumulate or hold steel in in anticipation of getting the order. So it is basically like it's a 22:58 22 minutes, 58 seconds very narrow within a very narrow timeline we cook the steel the moment we get the order for the file. 23:06 23 minutes, 6 seconds So uh eventually uh the volatility in the raw material prices is to the account of 23:14 23 minutes, 14 seconds the manufacturer. So for us let's say in this case so that is why number one like for example if these are the steel pipes 23:21 23 minutes, 21 seconds then we don't know like what kind of uh let's say diameter thickness metrology the new order will have uh and that is 23:28 23 minutes, 28 seconds where the order is placed only once we receive the firm order for steel pipes. 23:35 23 minutes, 35 seconds So this situation normally does not arise that the steel pipes going up and down is impacting uh the pipe layer very significantly. 23:44 23 minutes, 44 seconds Okay. as margins henceforth we bottomed out in 2016 and margins should now just be onwards and upwards 23:52 23 minutes, 52 seconds but can you repeat your question sorry I'm saying so margins would you would you be if I say margins have bottomed out and now margins would just be higher 23:59 23 minutes, 59 seconds from here going ahead we so that's what we thought uh for uh at the call of QT we said that perhaps 24:07 24 minutes, 7 seconds we have it has bottomed out okay and it's a function of all the things margins is not a function function of 24:14 24 minutes, 14 seconds only like sale price because if I'm if my capacity is under like the fit doors start hitting you 24:22 24 minutes, 22 seconds the now lot of contracts what industry is today serving they are delivered 24:30 24 minutes, 30 seconds products they are in case of international they are duty dealer product now nobody knows like how after the after 5th of May what the crude 24:39 24 minutes, 39 seconds prices will be in India also right so you people are enlisting you would know like whether the crew price goes up or the price goes up right so 24:48 24 minutes, 48 seconds the trade cost will go up so there are few things which are beyond the control the assumptions for the profitability 24:55 24 minutes, 55 seconds normally are made in the let's say a stable condition so as we mentioned in the very last line in the presentation 25:03 25 minutes, 3 seconds that these are very un unpredictable unpre unprecedented times everything is looking way so 25:12 25 minutes, 12 seconds if you say that this is bottomed out uh maybe may not be. 25:19 25 minutes, 19 seconds Okay. And there any other risk we can uh think of in terms of obviously one micro risk any other risk we are seeing at the 25:26 25 minutes, 26 seconds moment cuz uh you're trying to understand just from the business risk perspective. 25:32 25 minutes, 32 seconds We uh our this commentary actually is full of risk. What we said we have not given you high expectation except that 25:40 25 minutes, 40 seconds like uh we are doing we are projecting we are doing setting up the projects in Mina region but our our perspective are 25:49 25 minutes, 49 seconds to highlight to the to stakeholder to to all of you like we are living into the risky environments. We highlight it each 25:57 25 minutes, 57 seconds and every days. We highlight Jillian mission. We highlight the international shipping issue. We highlighted our API business issue in carbon steel. We highlighted the water business in Jalan. 26:08 26 minutes, 8 seconds So I mean there could be still issue which are which are very difficult to project this point of time. As I mentioned like if the if there is a 26:15 26 minutes, 15 seconds spike in the diesel side every the all all cost will become inflationary. So there are certain measures which the 26:22 26 minutes, 22 seconds management can take in terms of let's say controlling those risk. There still would be few risk which we may not be able to control but given the like good 26:32 26 minutes, 32 seconds liquidity good uh let's say position on the company and the balance sheet some of the risk we can still handle. 26:39 26 minutes, 39 seconds Okay. And last question for me so what capex number are we expecting for the next couple of years the capex for the next couple of years how much? 26:49 26 minutes, 49 seconds Yeah. Okay. So okay so few of the capex is what we are doing what we have done in last one or two three years time 26:56 26 minutes, 56 seconds maybe we are at the last um portion of those schemes maybe let's say 5 to 700 27:03 27 minutes, 3 seconds cr rupees all across India in this year and three project what we have announced 27:11 27 minutes, 11 seconds in Saudi and middle east they are of course sorry Abu Dhabi Abu Dhabi at this point of time like uh for a 27:20 27 minutes, 20 seconds [clears throat] seamless PI project we are 100%. uh so we are still trying to work out like what would be the debt equity what is going to be the revised 27:28 27 minutes, 28 seconds project cost we are trying to uh if there's some more efficiency in that project in terms of the cost in Saudi it 27:36 27 minutes, 36 seconds is a joint venture where we are 51% so our cost net impact of the cost on our balance sheet will lower otherwise then we are not expecting we are not putting 27:44 27 minutes, 44 seconds very significant let's say brownfield or green field projects in India so we are trying to let's say we try to work with the 27:52 27 minutes, 52 seconds available capacity within India but just trying to see like how best we can derisk our business model for example if 27:59 27 minutes, 59 seconds duct tile pipes had taken a backseat we are working out like the facility should not stop and let's try to work out 28:06 28 minutes, 6 seconds different options for that also the different export domestic shift and all those things 28:14 28 minutes, 14 seconds right sure sir so any number we have only 5 to 600 is that or will be more than that the number. 28:23 28 minutes, 23 seconds Yeah. Totally. 28:24 28 minutes, 24 seconds Yes. For this year, for this year, we expect 5 to 600 copies. 28:28 28 minutes, 28 seconds And for next year, I'm trying to get the broad base 27 28. So 500 for 27. 28:34 28 minutes, 34 seconds Okay. Let's put it this way. We have we have roughly 10 locations in the country, right? Earlier we earlier somehow we 28:41 28 minutes, 41 seconds used to set 250 300 but every time it works out to not less than 400, 500 and sometime when one or two more schemes 28:48 28 minutes, 48 seconds are going on some replacement all these things. So maybe like this year we have done 7 to 800. Next uh so 24 256 we did 28:58 28 minutes, 58 seconds both 800 maybe you can you can consider 500 to 600 this year 400 500 next year something like this. 29:07 29 minutes, 7 seconds Sure. Thank you sir. Thank you so much. Thank you. 29:12 29 minutes, 12 seconds Thank you ladies and gentlemen. In order to ensure that the management is able to address question from all the 29:20 29 minutes, 20 seconds participants in the conference, please limit your two question to per participants. Should you have a follow-up question, we would request you to rejoin the queue. 29:31 29 minutes, 31 seconds Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dan Hara from Green H1. Please go. 29:37 29 minutes, 37 seconds Yeah, thank you. Thank you for giving me the chance. Uh so I had one question. 29:42 29 minutes, 42 seconds See the macros are very uncertain and we may not want to guide that's perfectly fine but just wanted to know that in all the products that we have you know 29:50 29 minutes, 50 seconds basically saw pipe seamless pipes ductile iron stainless steel and HPE do you see any over capacity in the system 29:57 29 minutes, 57 seconds like you know if the demand bounces back say water in the next 12 months and you know oil and gas after say you know another 6 9 months you know will we 30:05 30 minutes, 5 seconds again go back to the old levels of profitability or is the capacity in the system high that we may need a higher level of demand to go there if you can just you know segment wise explain how 30:13 30 minutes, 13 seconds do you see the over capacity or you know in each of the segments where we operate. 30:19 30 minutes, 19 seconds Yeah Raji would you explain this? So uh uh as you mentioned that over capacity position if there is a demand which is 30:28 30 minutes, 28 seconds coming back. So what we feel that in dust 11 pipes uh there may be some uh 30:35 30 minutes, 35 seconds over supply in terms of capacities but apart from this other segments are uh 30:42 30 minutes, 42 seconds well placed like longitudinal helical as well as seamless. So if uh in future 30:49 30 minutes, 49 seconds demand is there the capacities are available to cater the demand there will not be any over capacity but the ductile 30:56 30 minutes, 56 seconds RN type pipe is something which we feel that over capacity position is there. 31:01 31 minutes, 1 second Okay. Okay. And then you know in these ductile iron pipes can we do something else in those lines or no we'll have to live with the lower utilization for some time. 31:11 31 minutes, 11 seconds So honestly speaking yes uh there will be u we have to live with this condition 31:18 31 minutes, 18 seconds because uh major capacity expansions in DI pipe uh was uh in the uh estimation 31:25 31 minutes, 25 seconds or anticipation of demand from J1 mission and multiple projects at the state levels. So but as of now because 31:34 31 minutes, 34 seconds Joel Gven mission uh scheme is not kicking off very well. So this this 31:40 31 minutes, 40 seconds position seems to be uh remaining as it is for quite some time. 31:46 31 minutes, 46 seconds Got it. Got it. And one data point is how much sales did we lose in you know because of the Middle East war you know like not getting ships not delivering 31:54 31 minutes, 54 seconds products. How much would we did like 13.76 lakh you know tons of volume this year like how much would you have lost 32:02 32 minutes, 2 seconds just in this quarter? How much would you have lost in terms of crores of rupees? 32:05 32 minutes, 5 seconds Like what would be the revenue loss? So basically uh there is there is no loss per say it is a deferment because shipments are 32:14 32 minutes, 14 seconds going to go once the situation is improved in this uh region. So approximately 30 to 40 uh material was 32:23 32 minutes, 23 seconds ready for shipment uh which got deferred. So apart from this there is no loss as such. 32:29 32 minutes, 29 seconds So this deferment would be worth 30 to 40 cr rupees right? 32:35 32 minutes, 35 seconds Uh so uh so in terms of value it would be more than that but uh as of now we have the quantities available which got referred. 32:46 32 minutes, 46 seconds Okay. Okay. 32:47 32 minutes, 47 seconds Okay. Okay. Fine sir. Fine sir. Thank you so much. I'll come back to the queue. 32:53 32 minutes, 53 seconds Thank you. The next question is from the line of God of Ninga from Tunga and Wishman. Please go ahead. 33:02 33 minutes, 2 seconds Yeah sir. Uh thank you for taking my question sir. I have two questions on the stainless steel pipes business. Uh the first question the first one is on 33:11 33 minutes, 11 seconds the stainless steel seamless pipes business. Sir uh we are hearing a lot of PLC adding capacity and they are 33:19 33 minutes, 19 seconds receiving approval in the critical piping segment as well. So wanted to get a sense from you on the its impact on 33:27 33 minutes, 27 seconds our overall business both in terms of capacity overall industry capacity and on the margins in the business that 33:36 33 minutes, 36 seconds question number one on seamless stainless steel pipes and second one is on the related training of seal pipes 33:43 33 minutes, 43 seconds and I wanted to get a sense from you because I think I think there has been some decline in the overall margins in this business. So how are the things 33:51 33 minutes, 51 seconds shaping up and how do you think about that business impact? Uh okay. 34:00 34 minutes In standard system type business uh we are trying to capture the you know the 34:08 34 minutes, 8 seconds upper uh andor upper end uh segment uh or the 34:15 34 minutes, 15 seconds customer who requires more stringent quality. Uh so impact of that will come. 34:25 34 minutes, 25 seconds uh I think in this year uh the second half so 34:33 34 minutes, 33 seconds but otherwise uh otherwise I say that completing business of this will face 34:41 34 minutes, 41 seconds the you know margin uh challenge okay uh sorry sir are you talking about 34:51 34 minutes, 51 seconds the seamless business or welded or both I'm talking both so and uh so we 34:59 34 minutes, 59 seconds have to capture the value added product and for that uh as you mentioned that uh we are trying to get the uh approval 35:07 35 minutes, 7 seconds from the customer and for our facility and for our products 35:16 35 minutes, 16 seconds uh but on the bandage side is there upper segment as well I thought that that will be true for the CBS business there upper segment within the bended as well. 35:26 35 minutes, 26 seconds Wended also. 35:28 35 minutes, 28 seconds Okay. Okay. We are trying to move up the ladder in terms of quality. 35:32 35 minutes, 32 seconds Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That is the only way or only way to capture the highend uh or 35:40 35 minutes, 40 seconds high margin business and that like that margin expansion will 35:46 35 minutes, 46 seconds happen from the second half of FI rotation. Is that the expectation? 35:51 35 minutes, 51 seconds Yeah. Yeah. actually say uh as already mentioned by Mr. Vini Gupta that at this 35:58 35 minutes, 58 seconds point of time everybody is a uh little uh slow in uh um investments and slow in giving the orders. 36:09 36 minutes, 9 seconds Okay. Okay. Got it sir. Got it sir. Thank you. 36:16 36 minutes, 16 seconds Thank you. 36:19 36 minutes, 19 seconds The next question is from the line of Wika Jen from Acquaintus Investment. Please go ahead. 36:26 36 minutes, 26 seconds Hi. Hello. 36:34 36 minutes, 34 seconds We lost you. 36:36 36 minutes, 36 seconds So the line dropped. The next question is from the line of Felish Raja from BK security. Please go ahead. 36:46 36 minutes, 46 seconds Yeah. Uh congrats sir for reporting strong positive CFO of 2018 uh even in this challenging times. Uh so given the 36:55 36 minutes, 55 seconds lower order intake uh expected from the Middle East due to ongoing challenges and talking about the new order intake. 37:02 37 minutes, 2 seconds So how are you approaching our selection in the near term? Is it this is specific to health our health capacity? Do we 37:10 37 minutes, 10 seconds wait for a recovery in Mina region to uh you know secure high margin orders or we uh open taking up you know the lower 37:19 37 minutes, 19 seconds margin orders in the domestic healthare segment to support uh utilization level. So what is our near-term strategy? 37:28 37 minutes, 28 seconds So Shal should uh presume this situation would start working out once the uh 37:37 37 minutes, 37 seconds region is fully operational because as of now the as of now there's a couple of regions are there where people are 37:44 37 minutes, 44 seconds flying for the safety for example u right the life is still not uh back to 37:51 37 minutes, 51 seconds track Saudi is still working operational but uh I The business has taken a bit uh 38:00 38 minutes back seat for everybody. Our stronghold in Mina region are like Saudi of course, Qatar, Roman, Iraq. Iraq is equally 38:09 38 minutes, 9 seconds disturbed at this point of time. So people are not thinking of giving the order immediately. The discussions which 38:18 38 minutes, 18 seconds perhaps are happening that how they have to create the energy security mechanism in near term. It might take year, two year, three year whatever. Coming to 38:26 38 minutes, 26 seconds your second question that I'm let's presume that there's a normaly in the region everything has been sorted out 38:33 38 minutes, 33 seconds shipment is not an issue uh uh ship ships are available insurance premiums uh have come down insurance available 38:41 38 minutes, 41 seconds and all those things are there then of course uh we would we would like to let's say uh we would like to have the 38:50 38 minutes, 50 seconds order book which should give a reasonable amount of visibility in terms of time and high utilization we are 38:57 38 minutes, 57 seconds still booked. Our facilities are still booked provided that we are allowed to uh produce and sell. So it's not that we 39:05 39 minutes, 5 seconds don't we have a slot available to take the order for immediate next two months 3 months. We actually we are fully 39:11 39 minutes, 11 seconds booked for couple of quarters. So if you have to if we have to given the option to take order we might not be able to 39:20 39 minutes, 20 seconds take order for next two or three or four quarters time. Uh so the uh to my understanding the industry is reasonably 39:30 39 minutes, 30 seconds booked uh for export as well as domestic. The only thing is the challenge is that you don't have means to transport and dispatch. 39:40 39 minutes, 40 seconds Okay. Okay. And just to give an example for the for the job work order what we have we are it's a six lakh order and we 39:48 39 minutes, 48 seconds are sitting off roughly two l of steel which is supplied by the uh the the the buyer we are holding on the steel and 39:57 39 minutes, 57 seconds you can't supply the pipes we are not making the pipes I mean storing the pipes will be a larger problem than storing the steel 40:05 40 minutes, 5 seconds okay okay sir uh you know both Indian and local players including ourselves are adding capacities. So do you believe 40:14 40 minutes, 14 seconds that there is a sufficient demand to support attractive returns like three four years payback on these investment and also could you please talk about you 40:23 40 minutes, 23 seconds know the opportunities in the GCC region for electric and DI pipe. 40:29 40 minutes, 29 seconds Uh so okay let's talk about the simplex ductile. We are not adding additional capacity in ductile. It is basically 40:37 40 minutes, 37 seconds like we are trying to we trying to set up a complimentary facility of our Abu Dhabi plant. We are what we are trying 40:45 40 minutes, 45 seconds to do for our Abu Dhabi plant that we should be able to have the access to the entire Mina region wherever there is some bottleneck. We are trying to let's 40:52 40 minutes, 52 seconds say set up a complimentary facility for that. It's not a full-fledged plant of let's say starting from the let's the 41:00 41 minutes from blast furnace going up to the finishing and everything. But in case of seamless and soft pipes they are green 41:08 41 minutes, 8 seconds field projects completely integrated with quoting all kind of quoting and everything and uh in 41:15 41 minutes, 15 seconds terms of in terms of let's say the demand we are we are fully conscious that there are uh the competition is 41:24 41 minutes, 24 seconds already there. they have acquired or they are setting up and we are considering yes uh the competition is always good for a healthy market but we 41:33 41 minutes, 33 seconds believe that there is enough demand and the demand has demand is likely to increase 41:40 41 minutes, 40 seconds exponentially because of this new crisis which has emerged in the main region. Uh this is giving additional uh this is top 41:48 41 minutes, 48 seconds up on that plane PA. So I mean we won't like to discuss too much on the call but we understand that there's enough on the plate. 41:58 41 minutes, 58 seconds Okay. Okay. So one last question. So as we plan to undertake significant capex over the next 2 three years with current 42:05 42 minutes, 5 seconds net debt at you know that 3,400 cr so what do you expect that peak debt level uh during this capex phase and additionally what is the peak net debt 42:13 42 minutes, 13 seconds per that we are comfortable operating at? 42:18 42 minutes, 18 seconds See uh we are we try to communicate uh to everyone that uh let's differentiate 42:25 42 minutes, 25 seconds between the working capital debt and the uh long-term debt. So out of the current debt uh we stand on 2,500 console 3,200 42:34 42 minutes, 34 seconds whatever. The long-term debt is hardly at it stand 525 cr at console it is 650 42:41 42 minutes, 41 seconds cr. So there's a good amount of appetite of uh the lenders to lend the long-term debt to the company for setting up the 42:50 42 minutes, 50 seconds projects and uh the since the it's a we we have demonstrated in the UAE in last couple of years. So there's a good 42:58 42 minutes, 58 seconds amount of traction among the lender they want to lend to us now as you know like because Indian lenders are also geared up through the gift city or direct 43:06 43 minutes, 6 seconds presence into the Mina region they are equally interested to lend to this. So appetite wise or can can the banish 43:14 43 minutes, 14 seconds sheet handle increase in the debt? Yes, balance sheet can handle increase in the debt. Secondly, as you mentioned that in Saudi we are not 100, it's not a 100% subsidiary. We are only we would be 51. 43:25 43 minutes, 25 seconds So a proportionate at the best a proportionate uh let's say impact would come uh in terms of debt to 43:35 43 minutes, 35 seconds again if you have to increase if you have to include the [clears throat] working capital debt into the overall indebtedness and then to test it. 43:43 43 minutes, 43 seconds Uh this of course will be on a bit elevated level. It depends like uh what we are talking when we are talking 43:50 43 minutes, 50 seconds because in 2425 uh we had the VA of 3,500 cr rupes and then we thought that in two years time we would have significantly higher VITA. 44:00 44 minutes So if we go back to the similar level in in um some time then we would still be in the range of let's say two two and a 44:09 44 minutes, 9 seconds half of that to be all included including working capital everything. 44:15 44 minutes, 15 seconds Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay sir. Thank you sir. All the best. 44:20 44 minutes, 20 seconds Thank you. The next question is from the line of Wika Jen from Equinus. Please go ahead. 44:28 44 minutes, 28 seconds Hello. Thank you for giving me the opportunity. Uh so my first question is in terms of uh we have started our business in Saudi and you have you 44:37 44 minutes, 37 seconds mentioned in your opening remarks about how uh things are not moving there. uh considering things as normal in war as 44:46 44 minutes, 46 seconds uh to be a better state uh how do you think the demand panning out over there also uh a lot of our competitors also 44:54 44 minutes, 54 seconds have their factories built into cloud so how do you see the competitive intensity there so okay mishika so first of first of all 45:03 45 minutes, 3 seconds like on our normality is there in the system uh our domestic facility in India that would be fully 45:11 45 minutes, 11 seconds functional and we'll start executing the export order. We have pipes in store and we would we'll start producing the pipe 45:19 45 minutes, 19 seconds out of the steel given free of cost by the buyer to us. That's one. Secondly, uh perhaps you want to mention like how 45:26 45 minutes, 26 seconds the domestic uh how the demand in Saudi or neighboring countries would be taken care of. So I I in my view in next one 45:36 45 minutes, 36 seconds year the majority of the requirement would still be serviced from the imports in Saudi 45:43 45 minutes, 43 seconds uh because like the uh whatever let's say people are doing they would still take some time to set up take approvals 45:51 45 minutes, 51 seconds and then meet the criteria and do it. So till that time if a major requirement comes that harve hopefully that would be 45:58 45 minutes, 58 seconds serviceed out of India and in next two years time I think we would also be operational we also operational then it 46:06 46 minutes, 6 seconds would be like how much demand is coming and how this is being serviced from the let's say the local units in the mina 46:13 46 minutes, 13 seconds region and it is not only Saudi we we are trying to uh let's say gauge the sense there is there is likely demand 46:22 46 minutes, 22 seconds from neighboring countries of Saudi also which would be serviced uh from Saudi and then by India. 46:33 46 minutes, 33 seconds Okay. Uh my second question is from the coal cost increase which we are seeing I think the whole cost has increase almost 46:40 46 minutes, 40 seconds 10 to 15%. So how is this how is the cost escalation being impacted? And we 46:47 46 minutes, 47 seconds how much is the spot and uh x is it in our order booking. 46:54 46 minutes, 54 seconds Now can you come uh come back which cost you said these will increase coin coin coin no so we never mentioned the co we said 47:03 47 minutes, 3 seconds we give an example is that how the inflation inflationary trends can impact the profitability and then I give the 47:11 47 minutes, 11 seconds example that if let's say the fuel cost increase or diesel cost increase or anything which is pushing the shipments increase it has overall impact on the 47:21 47 minutes, 21 seconds profitability because in case of sale majority of the sale happens on delayed basis. So whatever orders are sitting in 47:28 47 minutes, 28 seconds the order book for last couple of months or every year uh then some cost uh there will be some impact on the profitability 47:36 47 minutes, 36 seconds on account of the increased cost. Of course we would try our level best to pass on some of the cost but there's no guarantee that this cost would eventually be passed on to the buyer. 47:48 47 minutes, 48 seconds So earlier I remember we used to say there are variable contracts where the total pass on was around 30 to 35%. Has 47:56 47 minutes, 56 seconds this dependent increased for us in terms of variable contract? 48:00 48 minutes No. So when we when we say like these mechanism that that mechanism is uh restricted to let's say uh duct tile 48:09 48 minutes, 9 seconds projects and that was based on the identic indexation. So it is not for each and 48:17 48 minutes, 17 seconds every component of the product. It is the pigar based prices. So that because pigar has its index of pricing is fairly 48:26 48 minutes, 26 seconds uh let's say transparent. So that was where let's say a lot of volatility was there in the iron ore and core prices 48:33 48 minutes, 33 seconds and then some of the contracts had the this escalation clause right? 48:42 48 minutes, 42 seconds uh as you mentioned that uh 30 33% or the strategy was like that in ductile R5 48:49 48 minutes, 49 seconds uh to pass on the cost or to uh protect the company in uh from the volatility in raw metal prices especially for ductile 48:57 48 minutes, 57 seconds it was like that we do have the stocks with us also coal stocks we are getting the uh coal ships every quarter so that 49:05 49 minutes, 5 seconds is something which is already inbuilt in the uh pricing mechanism apart from this 13 states came out with the escalation 49:13 49 minutes, 13 seconds clause at uh as uh Vini mentioned uh through which uh that if the prices are moving beyond certain limits then 49:21 49 minutes, 21 seconds escalation metrics were there and we could pass on certain uh listed costs. 49:26 49 minutes, 26 seconds So that is a strategy which we are already following but that is predominantly for the local market domestic market. 49:38 49 minutes, 38 seconds Got it. Got it. uh and in terms of BI5 I think you mentioned in your uh investor report that you have a one year's order 49:47 49 minutes, 47 seconds however uh we are seeing that some state finances you know not getting the amount etc. So how is the execution phase right 49:54 49 minutes, 54 seconds now and what do you think of uh newer avenues like J1 mission 2 and uh PNG uh 50:01 50 minutes, 1 second incremental adoption of PNG how will this help PNG 50:10 50 minutes, 10 seconds PNG uh so we are mixing PNG with no no question is for ductile let me 50:18 50 minutes, 18 seconds just break my question is for Yeah. 50:22 50 minutes, 22 seconds Okay. So, right. 50:25 50 minutes, 25 seconds Okay. So, let's let's first discuss a detail. So, on let's say very high level ductile it 6 to 9 months ago people were 50:34 50 minutes, 34 seconds focused into JJ mission primarily and then there were some setbacks on liquidity issues in the DJ mission. Then 50:41 50 minutes, 41 seconds the states also moved to issue the orders based on their arrangement of financing and that's where the new 50:48 50 minutes, 48 seconds contracts which were coming they were coming back by the state uh funding. So state was arranging the funds to the 50:56 50 minutes, 56 seconds multilateral agencies domestic internship whatever. So there the they were not depending on the the geomission 51:02 51 minutes, 2 seconds funding whatever it is and those orders executions had also started embit the pricing uh and profitability on those 51:10 51 minutes, 10 seconds orders are different as compared to the pricing of the old orders. Now 51:17 51 minutes, 17 seconds we understand that the JG1 mission uh like there's some moment momentum in that and this is this is paper news also 51:26 51 minutes, 26 seconds like in the in the open public platform that center has released funds to some of the states which has gone to the 51:33 51 minutes, 33 seconds state government state has to uh let's say induct their own funds whatever percentage it is and then they will start moving the funds to the APC and 51:42 51 minutes, 42 seconds all so that system is still getting formalized. Uh we understand that there will be new mechanism monitoring system. 51:51 51 minutes, 51 seconds Now the the moto of the jion mission is also shifting from putting infrastructure to ensuring the service at the end level. So there there might 52:00 52 minutes be some initial hiccups in terms of fresh implementation but once it is set up then there'll be like it will 52:09 52 minutes, 9 seconds business as usual. There will be more uh monitoring from the center also but it 52:15 52 minutes, 15 seconds will be business as usual. Pending that the execution has a higher mix of state 52:22 52 minutes, 22 seconds bad funds backed by state funding and those executions are happening currently that is also reflected out of our fourth 52:30 52 minutes, 30 seconds quarter uh sale where majority of the sale is for the state bank funding. 52:37 52 minutes, 37 seconds Of course we are supplying to EPC and then second question is the ENG. 52:43 52 minutes, 43 seconds Uh no the second question is for the JT to the second 2.0 which has come. So when is the execution going to start? 52:50 52 minutes, 50 seconds Because if the current execution has not been completed and the money has not been received. So how how do we see the 52:59 52 minutes, 59 seconds mission 2.2 because system collapse. 53:07 53 minutes, 7 seconds So as of now the system uh the whole system because uh people like us or any pipe producer is in the value chain we 53:15 53 minutes, 15 seconds are in the supply chain only we don't we don't interface directly with the state or the center we are that that that 53:24 53 minutes, 24 seconds interface is by the EPC we supply pipe to almost every EPC who is uh who is buying pipe from anybody and everybody 53:33 53 minutes, 33 seconds challenges with the EPC for the liquidity you would be keeping you would talking to those al those also there is a issues with the EPC their small large 53:41 53 minutes, 41 seconds mediumsiz funds would be released to them they would settle their initial issues and then they will start buying it we still 53:49 53 minutes, 49 seconds feel that it might still take a month or two before the execution starts in a reasonable way 53:56 53 minutes, 56 seconds okay you think so maybe four milestones right yes you're right could be but it does 54:05 54 minutes, 5 seconds not mean that we are are producing we are we have a mix of uh business or orders state back as well as J1 54:15 54 minutes, 15 seconds okay the state back is happening J1 is not happening right is not happening in the full 54:23 54 minutes, 23 seconds right and if this this Mina region lock jam is cleared we have 54:32 54 minutes, 32 seconds export consignment which are on hold even those will Okay. 54:39 54 minutes, 39 seconds Okay. And for the distribution I was talking about Mr. Wika, 54:46 54 minutes, 46 seconds please rejoin the question key for more question. 54:49 54 minutes, 49 seconds Sure. Sure. Sure. Thank you. This is Thank you. 54:57 54 minutes, 57 seconds Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sil Kotari from Unique PMS. Please go ahead. 55:18 55 minutes, 18 seconds Mr. S I think he's not connected. Yeah. 55:22 55 minutes, 22 seconds The next question is from the line of Paloni Duta from Mansour Finance. Hello. Please go ahead. 55:30 55 minutes, 30 seconds Yes. 55:32 55 minutes, 32 seconds I just have one question. Uh can you just give us a idea about the current demand for the seamless pipe industry? I 55:39 55 minutes, 39 seconds mean industry as a whole also the margins there. 55:46 55 minutes, 46 seconds So demand in uh seamless segment domestically it is more or less 1.5 55:53 55 minutes, 53 seconds million approximately and uh there are multiple players. So uh as government or 56:01 56 minutes, 1 second the PSUs have announced certain projects in deep water exploration uh we we can see some opportunities big 56:09 56 minutes, 9 seconds opportunities to come uh when uh these projects are executed. So announcement is there intent is there government is 56:17 56 minutes, 17 seconds focusing on it. So there will be a demand and there will be a machine capacity to cater this demand. 56:25 56 minutes, 25 seconds Okay. You said it's 1.5 million t am I right? The demand. Yeah. Yeah. In domestic. 56:32 56 minutes, 32 seconds Okay. And sir, how are the margins there as of now? I mean to compare it to last year. 56:41 56 minutes, 41 seconds So margin product wise we are not discussing because we have multiple products. So you can uh get some sense uh from the 56:49 56 minutes, 49 seconds this is this is I'm asking you directionally that how would be the margins in that segment as of now versus last year directionally not in terms of absolute pattern. 57:01 57 minutes, 1 second So there will be yeah there will be improvement in margins in seamless 57:08 57 minutes, 8 seconds segments because we in that demand uh should remain robust and uh that will 57:15 57 minutes, 15 seconds actually result into the little bit better margin. 57:20 57 minutes, 20 seconds Okay. Answer broadly if somebody uh were to be buying steel from outside and making steel pipes and in a rising steel 57:29 57 minutes, 29 seconds price scenario should they be in a better off situation or it's not like that? No, it's not like that. 57:36 57 minutes, 36 seconds Okay. Okay. That's all from my side. Thank you sir. Thank you. 57:46 57 minutes, 46 seconds We take this as a last question. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. 57:54 57 minutes, 54 seconds We thank you very much to all the participants on this call as well as to ISIS direct uh for hosting this call and 58:02 58 minutes, 2 seconds uh we hope that the issues what we discuss gets overcome ASAP so that we have a good call next time. Thank you very much. 58:14 58 minutes, 14 seconds On behalf of ICICI being recorded And Jim will saw that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. 58:22 58 minutes, 22 seconds You may now disconnect your lines.