eMudhra Limited — Q4 FY26

eMudhra Ltd Q4 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uYKYg9qCsM Published: 6 days ago

0:00 Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Emodra Limited Q4 and FY26 earnings conference call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be 0:09 9 seconds in the listenon mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this 0:18 18 seconds conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that 0:25 25 seconds this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Wenitar Raman Shinasan, executive chairman. Sir, thank you and over to you. 0:36 36 seconds Thank you. Good [clears throat] afternoon to everyone joining us in this conference call today. I welcome all of 0:43 43 seconds you to our FY2026 results call and thank you for your continued trust in our company. FY 2026 0:52 52 seconds was a year of compounding momentum for us. We closed the year with a total income of 700 7,132 million up 35% 1:02 1 minute, 2 seconds yearonear and aida of 1,654 million up 33% and PAT of 1,100 million 1:12 1 minute, 12 seconds up 26%. Over a 5year horizon we have compounded PAT at 30.5% peranom. Our CFO 1:21 1 minute, 21 seconds will take you through the granular numbers shortly. My intent here is to give you the strategic and qualitative 1:28 1 minute, 28 seconds texture of year where we grew, why we grew and where we are poised towards. 1:35 1 minute, 35 seconds Imudra today is a three segment business. Enterprise solution accounts for 59% of the revenue and grew 55% 1:44 1 minute, 44 seconds yearonear in the last year with organic growth of 23% and acquisitive growth of 32%. Trust services business represent 20% of the revenue up 32% last year. 1:57 1 minute, 57 seconds Then pure services business is 21% of revenue and remained flat largely in line with the industry trends. In North 2:05 2 minutes, 5 seconds America, our services business has continued to create enterprise relationships and we will continue to 2:12 2 minutes, 12 seconds pursue cross-ell opportunities into our product portfolio. From this base, growth in enterprise solutions has been 2:20 2 minutes, 20 seconds the defining feature of FYI 2026. Our certificate life cycle management platform set and our identity and access 2:28 2 minutes, 28 seconds management platform secure passed enterprise accounts across financial services, government, energy and 2:36 2 minutes, 36 seconds education globally and the proportion of productled revenue in our mix has grown. 2:42 2 minutes, 42 seconds On geography, international revenue is now 64% of our total and grew nearly 39% 2:49 2 minutes, 49 seconds yearonear. We operate from 15 offices across five regions and serve customers in more than 35 countries. North America 2:58 2 minutes, 58 seconds accounts for 34% of our revenue, India 36%, Europe 12%, Middle East and Africa 3:05 3 minutes, 5 seconds 11% and Asia Pacific 7%. In North America, a notable win this year was a large TLS certificate order for a 3:14 3 minutes, 14 seconds university federation in the United States, which is a meaningful step in establishing our credibility across US 3:21 3 minutes, 21 seconds markets. In Europe, the acquisition of Cryptos brought with it prime sign and EAS aligned trust service provider. 3:29 3 minutes, 29 seconds Cryptos integration is going on. We are actively cross-selling our CLM platform into the crypto's customer base and 3:37 3 minutes, 37 seconds expect deals to close in the next few quarters. NISTU and Dora continue to drive demand for compliant PKI and 3:45 3 minutes, 45 seconds identity controls across European banks and critical infrastructure 3:51 3 minutes, 51 seconds [clears throat] 3:55 3 minutes, 55 seconds infrastructure in India. In India, our trust services franchisee continues to perform uh steadily with our eain 4:03 4 minutes, 3 seconds business processing over well over three lakh daily transaction in banking and financial services. In the Middle East, 4:11 4 minutes, 11 seconds we have completed e signature workflow rollouts for banking customers in Oman and are seeing continued upgrades across 4:18 4 minutes, 18 seconds the existing base. Africa is an area of growing focus. We have active DPA deployments underway including 4:26 4 minutes, 26 seconds certificate life cycle management for critical IT infrastructure and e signature rollouts across government and banking. The continent represents a 4:34 4 minutes, 34 seconds significant long-term opportunity for our end to end DPH stack covering digital ID PKE passports and eain and we 4:43 4 minutes, 43 seconds are investing in building our presence there. On infrastructure, we now have data centers operating in the United States, Europe, and UAE and India. 4:54 4 minutes, 54 seconds Positioned to meet data sovereignty requirements across our P markets, enterprises and governments are increasingly requiring that 5:02 5 minutes, 2 seconds cryptographic operations and identity workflows are processed within their jurisdiction and our multi-reion 5:09 5 minutes, 9 seconds footprint addresses this directly. Our R&D investments in postquantum cryptography, Satinext and secure pass 5:16 5 minutes, 16 seconds have translated into customer wins across our target markets. Satin next added accounts in gaming, ERP, energy 5:23 5 minutes, 23 seconds and financial services across the US and Europe and in critical infrastructure in Africa. Secure pass one mandates 5:31 5 minutes, 31 seconds mandates with defense agencies, large banks and government departments in India requiring converged identity 5:39 5 minutes, 39 seconds management. Our ongoing R&D is focused on two areas. Agentic AI is being embedded as a capability layer across 5:48 5 minutes, 48 seconds all our four platforms. As AI agents act on behalf of the enterprises, they require digital identities. Signed, 5:56 5 minutes, 56 seconds [clears throat] authorizations and audit trades which our products are built to operate. The data privacy stack addresses the need to manage, protect 6:05 6 minutes, 5 seconds and demonstrate compliance around personal data aligned with India's DPDP act and GDPR in Europe. On quality and 6:13 6 minutes, 13 seconds governance in FI 2026, we renewed or maintained CMMA level 5 6:20 6 minutes, 20 seconds web trust, web trust, ISO 27,0001 and sock 2 type2 certifications. Immudra remains the only Indian certifying 6:29 6 minutes, 29 seconds authority listed in all major browser trust stores. On CSR, our focus has been on digital public infrastructure, skill 6:37 6 minutes, 37 seconds building and training where we see a natural role at the intersection of digital identity, PK and egovernance. 6:46 6 minutes, 46 seconds FYI 2027 is a year of productled growth organized around three themes. One, cyber security. The convergence of agent 6:55 6 minutes, 55 seconds KI zero trust mandates postquantum risk is driving enterprise demand for data security products. DPA deployments in 7:05 7 minutes, 5 seconds emerging and frontier markets. Several pipeline opportunities in Africa, the Middle East and Asia Pacific are at 7:12 7 minutes, 12 seconds advanced stages and theme and banking adoption of Mser large untapped opportunity in India MSME segment and 7:20 7 minutes, 20 seconds across the banking sector addressed also through product simplification and partner distribution. 7:31 7 minutes, 31 seconds We remain open to selective bolt-on acquisitions where they being where they 7:38 7 minutes, 38 seconds bring differentiated AI based cyber security capabilities or accelerate our market access. Our ambition is to double 7:47 7 minutes, 47 seconds PAT over the next 3 years. The tailwinds are clear. AI, data sovereignity, P2C 7:54 7 minutes, 54 seconds transition and tightening compliance requirements are all driving demand for the products we build. We remain focused 8:02 8 minutes, 2 seconds on innovation to develop solutions that are the need of the ever for global markets. Thank you and I will now hand 8:09 8 minutes, 9 seconds over to our CFO Mr. Reesh Pyani uh for the detailed financial commentary after which we will be happy to take your questions. Thank you. 8:19 8 minutes, 19 seconds Thank you chairman. Good afternoon everyone. I'm pleased to share the highlights of our quarter 4 and financial year 2026 8:26 8 minutes, 26 seconds performance. Our total income for quarter 4 financial year 2026 was INR 8:33 8 minutes, 33 seconds INR 1,966 million making a 31.7% year-over-year growth. Gross profit for 8:40 8 minutes, 40 seconds the quarter grew 32.6% year-over-year to INR 1037 million with a margin of 52.8%. 8:48 8 minutes, 48 seconds Ibida for the quarter was INR 441 million registering a 25.5% year-over-year growth with a margin of 22.4%. 8:58 8 minutes, 58 seconds Profit after tax for the quarter was INRA 296 billion reflecting a 21.6% year-over-year growth with a margin of 15.1%. 9:07 9 minutes, 7 seconds Now turning to the financial year 2026 performance. Total income for the year was INR 7,132 million representing a 9:15 9 minutes, 15 seconds 35.1% year-over-year growth. The enterprise solution and service segment generated revenue of INR 5,6160 million 9:23 9 minutes, 23 seconds while the trust service revenue was INR 1,400 million. Ebida was INR 1,654 9:30 9 minutes, 30 seconds million resisting a 32.6% year-over-year growth with a margin of 23.2%. 9:36 9 minutes, 36 seconds While PET was INR 1,100 million grow growing 26.2% year-over-year with a margin of 15.4%. 9:45 9 minutes, 45 seconds That conclude my remarks. Thank you. And we may now open the floor for the question answer session. 9:52 9 minutes, 52 seconds Thank you very much. We'll now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star 9:59 9 minutes, 59 seconds and one on their touchstone phone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. 10:07 10 minutes, 7 seconds Participants are requested to use handset while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we'll wait for a moment while the question cue assembles. 10:21 10 minutes, 21 seconds The first question is from the line of Suri Bellweather Capital. Please go ahead. 10:30 10 minutes, 30 seconds Hi. Uh thank you for taking my question. 10:32 10 minutes, 32 seconds Uh first of all uh thanks for improved disclosures in the PPT. My first question is on the US product business. 10:40 10 minutes, 40 seconds Uh Google had a policy change on the multi-purpose certificate side for the new root certificates and I think that's 10:46 10 minutes, 46 seconds on 15th June deadline for uh all the new root certificates that are going to be issued. Uh we were in a process of 10:54 10 minutes, 54 seconds getting these approvals done. Wanted to get get a sense of what's the update on this side. 11:00 11 minutes Uh Suri I'll take this question. So the 15th June was not really a deadline. It was more policy change that they 11:07 11 minutes, 7 seconds keepffecting every year. Our new roots have been submitted some time back. Uh so they are in the process of queuing it up. As you know they have to distribute 11:15 11 minutes, 15 seconds these trust stores across all of their you know environments like you know Chrome, Android etc. Uh so nothing stops 11:23 11 minutes, 23 seconds for us because our existing roots are already trusted on Google and we basically have a transition period where the existing roots will continue to work 11:32 11 minutes, 32 seconds until the new roots are accepted by Google. Right? So there is really no impact as such. We just await their process and timeline on the new route 11:39 11 minutes, 39 seconds acceptance. Until then we continue to issue from our existing route. 11:43 11 minutes, 43 seconds Got it. Got it. And uh with the uh 238 crude order book that we have you know called out wanted to get a sense on 11:51 11 minutes, 51 seconds what's your outlook on the US product business uh what kind of lead pipelines are you seeing any PCs that we are doing 11:58 11 minutes, 58 seconds uh how would you attribute uh you know the US product business out of this 238 crores 12:05 12 minutes, 5 seconds yeah if you see US product business almost last year it was around 6 and a half to 7 million within that range from 12:12 12 minutes, 12 seconds there it has come to more than 9 and a half million kind of level. So that kind of growth we have achieved in the US product itself. Now another thing 12:21 12 minutes, 21 seconds recently as we have mentioned we have got a good order from a university consortium called in common and they 12:29 12 minutes, 29 seconds have almost how many 700 700 university enrolled. So this order from a US trust service vendor it has been now given to 12:38 12 minutes, 38 seconds us. So we are going to process the entire TLS certificate for this consortium consisting of so many universities. So this is a very big 12:47 12 minutes, 47 seconds order and it will give a good visibility across the entire 700 universities and also across several other segment and 12:56 12 minutes, 56 seconds this has been even the our competitors like digert and then the key factor they have published about this. They have 13:04 13 minutes, 4 seconds issued a press statement about this. So, so with this I feel next year also we can see 25 30% growth definitely in the US product segment if not more. 13:16 13 minutes, 16 seconds Okay. Will it be possible to quantify uh this deal ballpark? 13:22 13 minutes, 22 seconds Quantify this deal we are not supposed to intimate the number for each separate deal. 13:29 13 minutes, 29 seconds Got it. No problem sir. And uh it's fair to assume right the order book that we have disclosed is largely on the product business side and does not include any service element. 13:38 13 minutes, 38 seconds Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Product business only. 13:40 13 minutes, 40 seconds And another thing is the if you see uh generally we projected two times the order book. So this time the from 13:48 13 minutes, 48 seconds February end this war in Middle East started. So some of the Middle East orders which would have come in March they are all getting delayed but it is 13:56 13 minutes, 56 seconds getting delayed nevertheless it will come. So that's where we have projected little over two times maybe 2.2 2.3 times the order book as the next year projection. 14:06 14 minutes, 6 seconds Got it. Uh I have one more question on the PTC product stack. Uh wanted to get a sense that are we seeing any deployment opportunities trying to test 14:15 14 minutes, 15 seconds this product? Any PC that we are running on the PQC side? Yeah, quite a few PC's are going on in PQC because now there 14:22 14 minutes, 22 seconds are clear-cut mandates uh both from domestic regulators as well as global bodies on how do you transition. So we are working on PC. Some of them will 14:31 14 minutes, 31 seconds come to fruition at least in a closed user group scenario effective essentially this financial year. But I think there are clear directives by 2029 14:39 14 minutes, 39 seconds 2030 that many companies that are running critical infrastructure have to essentially move out of the conventional algorithms to PQC. 14:48 14 minutes, 48 seconds Got it. Can you give a kosher can you give some flavor on where these deployments are? Are these in regulated industries like BFSI or healthcare? Any 14:56 14 minutes, 56 seconds sense on where are we seeing these deployment opportunities? 15:00 15 minutes Uh mostly in BFSI particularly critical large banks. Second is defense right and some critical government agencies. 15:08 15 minutes, 8 seconds All right. Thank you. I'll get back in the question too. Yeah. 15:14 15 minutes, 14 seconds Thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question 15:21 15 minutes, 21 seconds is from the line of Frankage and individual investor. Please go ahead. 15:26 15 minutes, 26 seconds Hi, good afternoon. Uh firstly, lots of congratulations for a fantastic result. 15:31 15 minutes, 31 seconds My quick couple of questions are one is uh uh Mr. Chairman mentioned that you're looking you're open to kind of product 15:38 15 minutes, 38 seconds acquisitions. So what kind of technology or what kind of geography you are you have in mind for those kind of execution that's one point number two is there is 15:47 15 minutes, 47 seconds a dispute which is going with the 3i info would be would appreciate if you can put some more light around that uh 15:54 15 minutes, 54 seconds third question is yes sorry you're saying something no no no question answer these two 16:02 16 minutes, 2 seconds question then we'll go to the third question sure sir question is product No product 16:10 16 minutes, 10 seconds acquisition as of now we do not have anything in the pipeline mainly. So that's why unlike last year and previous 16:17 16 minutes, 17 seconds year where acquisitions happened around July August it may not happen now mostly we may have to evaluate because in our 16:25 16 minutes, 25 seconds our CLM secure pass in all these areas I think our feature set is very good and we are comparing continuously with the 16:33 16 minutes, 33 seconds global competitors and we feel that our features are good and with that we can compete. The main area will be the AI 16:40 16 minutes, 40 seconds integration of AI into this identity authentication and cyber security suit. 16:45 16 minutes, 45 seconds If such any such product company which is a small company is available then that we may consider acquisition maybe 16:53 16 minutes, 53 seconds could be in third quarter or fourth quarter but still we have not evaluated any company but if at all such a company is available most likely it may be in US 17:01 17 minutes, 1 second only may not be in other geographies. So that's why your question of which geography we are thinking could be US 17:08 17 minutes, 8 seconds only. So this is the answer to the first question. Then the then the second question is the 3A infoch on the 3A 17:16 17 minutes, 16 seconds infoch matter though we clarified everything after that nothing has moved. 17:20 17 minutes, 20 seconds So we have not got the complaint from the police or any inquiry from the police and all that. Similarly though they said they are going to file a 17:28 17 minutes, 28 seconds complaint with SEBI we have not got anything from them. So and another important thing is the because they have 17:35 17 minutes, 35 seconds taken all these actions without any giving any opportunity to us to explain or what is to be done and all that we have also sent a legal notice to 3A 17:44 17 minutes, 44 seconds infoch and its directors that what they have done is wrong and uh so there also we are awaiting their reply. So as such 17:52 17 minutes, 52 seconds nothing really has progressed on either side compared to what it was months back. 17:59 17 minutes, 59 seconds Thank you sir. Thanks a lot. The last question is about FI27 guidance both in terms of top line and bottom line. 18:05 18 minutes, 5 seconds Yeah, FYI27 we are expecting from a topline perspective because as I said we are not thinking of last year we did 18:12 18 minutes, 12 seconds acquisition also. So there was organic growth and acquisition growth organic growth was around 19%. This year we are 18:20 18 minutes, 20 seconds expecting an organic growth of around because the base has also increased around 15 to 18% most likely 18% organic 18:28 18 minutes, 28 seconds growth is possible. This is what we are expecting. So top line is 18% but bottom line maybe around between 25 to 30% 18:37 18 minutes, 37 seconds could be around 27 28% kind of thing and as I said earlier we want to double the bottom line in a three-ear time frame. 18:44 18 minutes, 44 seconds So that is where we are working on. So this is the guidance. 18:49 18 minutes, 49 seconds Great sir. Thank you. And again lots of congratulations to the whole team. 18:54 18 minutes, 54 seconds Thank one more question you wanted to ask. Good sir. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, sir. 19:00 19 minutes Yes, thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. 19:23 19 minutes, 23 seconds A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. 19:35 19 minutes, 35 seconds A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the 19:43 19 minutes, 43 seconds line of Rishi Maheshwari from Axa Capital. Please go ahead. 19:50 19 minutes, 50 seconds Hi, thanks and congratulations on a great set of numbers. I want to understand on slide 10 uh the kind of uh 19:57 19 minutes, 57 seconds growth driver that you've written from artificial intelligence perspective. uh my sense is that there are threats and there are opportunities the 20:05 20 minutes, 5 seconds opportunities that you've mentioned over there uh from uh the agentic AI as it uh as it forms an attack 20:13 20 minutes, 13 seconds the the attack surface expanding um and therefore the foundation models such as anthropic claude which uh uh which 20:20 20 minutes, 20 seconds therefore increases your uh uh capacity and scope to work uh however um we've 20:27 20 minutes, 27 seconds also read from several um uh you know literature that myth OS is also claiming 20:33 20 minutes, 33 seconds to have its own uh um uh software for cyber security um to some extent. Can 20:40 20 minutes, 40 seconds you clarify that myth in terms of whether you know uh whether the attackers themselves can have a cyber security product because from what I've 20:49 20 minutes, 49 seconds also read on Zcaler Zcaler um and other similar products they've also been under some form of thread uh is what is 20:58 20 minutes, 58 seconds mentioned in some of the literature or the news articles that have spread across this. 21:03 21 minutes, 3 seconds Yeah, let me clarify that a bit. So andro just anthropic claude mythos etc are various models right. So with mythos 21:11 21 minutes, 11 seconds the whole idea is it has a completely new set of capabilities to kind of break open any infrastructure right in terms 21:19 21 minutes, 19 seconds of pointing out what kind of vulnerabilities that kind of exist in your infrastructure. So anthropic mythos is largely a model it is not a product 21:26 21 minutes, 26 seconds in itself that it can sort of solve for various things that today various cyber security vendors do that is to deploy 21:34 21 minutes, 34 seconds certificates or manage identity. So mythos is a LLM or a foundational model that gives you now advanced capabilities to figure out what the vulnerabilities 21:42 21 minutes, 42 seconds in your ecosystem are. So you're absolutely right in that context that the attack surface is now significantly expand because whatever was undetected 21:50 21 minutes, 50 seconds now becomes uh to the forefront in terms of enterprises needing to significantly better their cyber security posture. 21:58 21 minutes, 58 seconds Right? So very recently a couple of days back a very large public sector bank itself announced that they will ramp up their cyber security spends by 50%. So 22:06 22 minutes, 6 seconds so that is what mythos is capable of. So enterprises are obviously more worried saying what's going to happen uh and 22:14 22 minutes, 14 seconds essentially product companies like us help them better the cyber security posture. 22:19 22 minutes, 19 seconds Thanks. Thanks. uh in the context of this uh isn't uh the guidance that you have claimed at least uh you know for the overall and I'm presuming large part 22:28 22 minutes, 28 seconds of it is flowing from enterprise is slightly underwhelming given the kind of given the nature of growth in terms of 22:36 22 minutes, 36 seconds cyber security that is anticipated uh should be far higher. What is your thought on this? No, we always want to 22:44 22 minutes, 44 seconds estimate in a reasonable way and then think that almost if you see last four five years whatever guidance we have 22:52 22 minutes, 52 seconds given we have achieved 100%. So we don't want to overestimate anything because in the world so many thing can change in spite of all our knowledge and all our 23:00 23 minutes belief everything. So that's where this estimate what we are giving with a 100% conviction without doubt kind of thing. 23:09 23 minutes, 9 seconds Yes. How would you break this estimate in terms of revenue? Where would you classify how much growth would come from enterprise uh from services and from 23:17 23 minutes, 17 seconds trust services? Services mostly no growth will come because that is in line with the general services trend across the world. Then the trust services last year 30% came predominantly in India. 23:29 23 minutes, 29 seconds This year we estimate 20% will come. But the balance growth predominantly will come in the uh enterprise product. 23:37 23 minutes, 37 seconds That's where the main segment growth. So there the growth we estimate is almost 25 to 30%. 23:46 23 minutes, 46 seconds Right sir and what drives this when we say revenue even though sometime the order may come more it is all to be 23:55 23 minutes, 55 seconds because these are all large bank large government and other thing when it gets executed only we can recognize as 24:02 24 minutes, 2 seconds revenue for the execution apart from our software lot of time their infrastructure their team and so many 24:09 24 minutes, 9 seconds things are required so with the result immediately everything may not be able to recognize as a revenue So considering all this only we are 24:17 24 minutes, 17 seconds suggesting this kind of a uh estimate we are giving but generally there are there any changes in the revenue model or the 24:26 24 minutes, 26 seconds revenue recognition principles or the way in which the commercialization used to happen versus it is happening now for instance with the IT services when it's 24:34 24 minutes, 34 seconds happening on from a you know the change is very large and prevalent from a TNM model to an outcome based model yours was not strictly in that sense but is 24:42 24 minutes, 42 seconds there any change that is happening sir that is mainly for the IT service industry. They are talking about the change in the model but our services is 24:51 24 minutes, 51 seconds only in total only 20 21% services. So in that if it happens to some extent on 24:58 24 minutes, 58 seconds the outcome model also we may not be affected much and we are not estimating much growth in that segment also product there is no change we still 25:06 25 minutes, 6 seconds continue to do the recurring billing as well as a license model. Yeah. 25:11 25 minutes, 11 seconds All right. And and what is driving the efficiency in terms of PAT growing by about 27 28% as you projected? 25:19 25 minutes, 19 seconds Pat we are yeah what is driving the efficiency means with more product going because if you see product gross margin 25:26 25 minutes, 26 seconds is much higher compared to the services and services. So that's where the the the gross margin will grow higher. 25:34 25 minutes, 34 seconds Similarly aida will grow higher and pat will also grow higher if we do more product business. 25:40 25 minutes, 40 seconds So if you see product composition it be composition wise it will increase because the service is not at all going 25:50 25 minutes, 50 seconds thank you sir thank you so much all the best yeah thank you the next question is from the 25:58 25 minutes, 58 seconds line of harsh kachi from band tree advisers please go ahead hi thank you for the opportunity uh 26:07 26 minutes, 7 seconds first of all congratulations on the great set of numbers I have a few questions. I'll begin with a couple of them and and then maybe we 26:15 26 minutes, 15 seconds can proceed with the with the further questions. My first question is on the line of geography mix. So which 26:22 26 minutes, 22 seconds geographies do you expect will drive the enterprise solutions growth over the next few years? Are the uh upfront 26:29 26 minutes, 29 seconds investments in the senior hire data center and the new offices in the US that you set up are they beginning to translate into stronger deals in the 26:38 26 minutes, 38 seconds pipeline and conversion over there? And uh second question is uh on the India enterprise business we saw a decline uh 26:46 26 minutes, 46 seconds this quarter. So is this largely due to a high base in Q4 FY25 or are there any underlying demand related factors we should be aware of? 26:57 26 minutes, 57 seconds Yes, if you see geography wise we have invested in senior management resource in US and also we did acquisition in US 27:05 27 minutes, 5 seconds and that resulted in cross-selling and as I explained earlier uh from the last year to this year the our product 27:12 27 minutes, 12 seconds business grew by almost 30 35%. from almost 7 million to 9 and a half million 27:19 27 minutes, 19 seconds kind of thing. So now I also explained we won a recent good order where it is a 27:26 27 minutes, 26 seconds consortium of universities consisting some 700 universities and all that. So that momentum is there in the US market and in the US we have also invested in 27:35 27 minutes, 35 seconds the data center which is also starting to yield result. The other markets which are growing is the Middle East market as 27:42 27 minutes, 42 seconds well as the Africa market. In Africa market we are in discussion with the number of uh uh potential deals. So 27:50 27 minutes, 50 seconds those will also win. So that way we the the win will be across many market and Europe market also through cryptos we 27:57 27 minutes, 57 seconds are trying to sell our products where lot of demos are being given lot of discussions are happening. So across 28:04 28 minutes, 4 seconds markets this win it is not peculiar to one market. Then coming to your question on India market. The India market mainly 28:11 28 minutes, 11 seconds if you see in one quarter because the last quarter was much bigger this quarter is a drop but you see here as a 28:18 28 minutes, 18 seconds whole there is a good growth only enterprise business in India also saw a 27.6% to 6% growth year as old. So we 28:25 28 minutes, 25 seconds cannot exactly see every quarter after quarter what will happen. So that way it is a good growth only. 28:31 28 minutes, 31 seconds Yeah. And in Q3 we had a deal from defense which was slightly larger. 28:34 28 minutes, 34 seconds That's why yeah optic appears that okay understood. Um just a next couple 28:42 28 minutes, 42 seconds of uh questions. One is uh trust services view uh even strongly even after the new income tax circular 28:50 28 minutes, 50 seconds because of which the requirement for digital signature certificates has come down. So uh what is driving this truck 28:57 28 minutes, 57 seconds services growth and secondly u the prime sign uh subsidiary of krypass. So the 29:04 29 minutes, 4 seconds revenue from this particular entity is classified under trust services or under enterprise solution. No, up to now it is 29:12 29 minutes, 12 seconds classified under enterprise solution only because uh still it is sold along with other things also. So it is classified and range. So our trust 29:20 29 minutes, 20 seconds services growth is mainly because of the in within the partner model we have 29:28 29 minutes, 28 seconds enhancing the other services and also the combination of instead of a simple digital signature the uh combo 29:35 29 minutes, 35 seconds certificates are sold and number also slightly increasing and then our direct retail is also increasing. So with that com and and earlier we were not focusing 29:44 29 minutes, 44 seconds on token now token also tokens we are selling separately now token also we have put in the portal and directly people are purchasing the tokens so all 29:53 29 minutes, 53 seconds these and eain also has increased some of the eain along with mainer goes in the enterprise pure eain which is only 30:00 30 minutes used for signature goes in the dress services so all this combination has resulted in this 30% growth 30:09 30 minutes, 9 seconds understood just One last question from my side. Uh just wanted to understand the level of integration of products in 30:16 30 minutes, 16 seconds the enterprise solutions business. So if you win a client, what are the reasons why they might switch to another vendor 30:23 30 minutes, 23 seconds and how difficult it is for them? Just wanted to get some color on this. 30:28 30 minutes, 28 seconds Now our products are fairly core. Uh so the two products that we largely sell is the identity authentication and access and then the certificate life cycle 30:36 30 minutes, 36 seconds management. uh these sit at the heart of many of their core workflows. For instance, the authentication system for 30:44 30 minutes, 44 seconds a large bank essentially powers customer authentication when you log into internet banking. So that way we are more core to the system than peripheral. 30:52 30 minutes, 52 seconds So we think that the switchability or replacement is a cumbersome affair for anybody that once they implement it they try and do that. Right. 31:02 31 minutes, 2 seconds Understood. Thank you so much. I'll join back with you. 31:08 31 minutes, 8 seconds Thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question 31:16 31 minutes, 16 seconds is from the line of Serby from Bellweather Capital. Please go ahead. 31:22 31 minutes, 22 seconds Uh hi, I wanted to understand more on the crosscut opportunities. I think we were looking at some opportunities and identity and access management solution 31:30 31 minutes, 30 seconds in the US. wanted to get some sense on what's the traction there and is anything materializing 31:37 31 minutes, 37 seconds no the identity access management we have not taken to the US uh because that is still not part of the full plan more focus was on certificate life cycle 31:45 31 minutes, 45 seconds management where there is you know good traction building up and like we said the new order that we won is giving more impetus to that as of now so as of now 31:54 31 minutes, 54 seconds the identity access management product the immediate focus for this year is to take it to adjoining markets outside of India because we have strong references and credibility built here. So some of 32:02 32 minutes, 2 seconds the other emerging markets in Asia Pacific maybe Middle East Africa is where the first attempt would be. 32:08 32 minutes, 8 seconds Perfect. And I have one bookkeeping question. Uh what will be the full year contribution from cryptos uh on the revenue and p side? 32:18 32 minutes, 18 seconds Last year uh krypto's revenue was 85 cr for the whole year and from a pat side 32:26 32 minutes, 26 seconds almost to break even in like what I described in the last quarter. The first quarter of integration it was some maybe 32:33 32 minutes, 33 seconds 2 cr or 1.6 cr loss and in the second quarter of integration it was some 2 cr profit so not much maybe totally one or 32:41 32 minutes, 41 seconds two cr profit and from an efficiency perspective for profitability where do you expect uh 32:48 32 minutes, 48 seconds cryptos to be with once we replace um uh the product with our solution? 32:54 32 minutes, 54 seconds Yeah no that is a continuous effort. So now already in eight or nine conversation instead of the other 33:03 33 minutes, 3 seconds American company CLM solution we are proposing our CLM solution. Once those happens then the profitability will 33:10 33 minutes, 10 seconds increase. This year almost we are expecting estimating almost over a million dollar of profit from the 33:17 33 minutes, 17 seconds cryptos. But that will also depend on how far we are able to they are able to sell our CLM solution instead of the uh 33:25 33 minutes, 25 seconds American CLM solution and all that. And as you know the sales cycle in Europe typically tend to be long. Yeah. Because all of these are large banks. So we are 33:33 33 minutes, 33 seconds also waiting or planning for that kind of a sales cycle. Understood. Okay. Thank you so much. 33:42 33 minutes, 42 seconds Yeah. Thank you. 33:43 33 minutes, 43 seconds Thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. 34:15 34 minutes, 15 seconds As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Wanker Raman Shrinasan for closing comments. 34:26 34 minutes, 26 seconds Thank you. So I would like to thank everyone for joining the call today. We remain focused on delivering consistent performance and innovative solutions 34:35 34 minutes, 35 seconds that enable secure digital transformation for our clients across the globe. For any additional information or queries, kindly get in 34:42 34 minutes, 42 seconds touch with our investment relation advisers, certate partners. Thank you once again. Thank you. 34:50 34 minutes, 50 seconds Thank you. On behalf of E-Mudra Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.