Cosmic CRF Ltd — Q4 FY26

Cosmic CRF Ltd Q4 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VYpgVRTg7Q Published: 3 weeks ago

0:01 1 second Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of Captify Consulting Investor relations team, I welcome you all to the H2 and 0:08 8 seconds FI26 post earnings conference call of Cosmic CRF Limited. Today on the call, we have with us Mr. Adita Vikram Bila, 0:17 17 seconds chairman and managing director. As a disclaimer, I would like to inform inform all of you that this call may contain forward-looking statements which may involve risk and uncertainties. 0:26 26 seconds Also, a reminder that this call is being recorded. I would now request the management to briefly run us through the investor presentation with the business 0:33 33 seconds and performance highlights for the period ended March 2026. The growth plan and vision for the coming year post which we will open the floor for Q&A over to the management team. 0:45 45 seconds Hi everyone. Good good good I think it's good evening right? Good evening. Good evening everyone. Uh uh we can quickly go through uh thank you V for the uh introduction and uh hand it over to me. 0:55 55 seconds Uh I will just take some time and uh run this entire presentation that we made uh so that everybody can have a brief as to what we want to say through this 1:04 1 minute, 4 seconds presentation. It's a long one but we will take roughly 20 odd minutes to quickly go through the presentation and then we can straight away jump to the question and answer rounds. Right. Does it make sense V? 1:13 1 minute, 13 seconds Yeah. Yeah. Please go ahead. 1:15 1 minute, 15 seconds Okay. Okay. Thanks. So, good evening everyone once again. Um I'll straight away jump to the page number three of 1:22 1 minute, 22 seconds this uh of this presentation which states the basic of what we are doing in Cosmic CRF. Uh Cosmic CRF started in 1:29 1 minute, 29 seconds 2022 incorporated with 22 and was listed on the 30th of June 2023. Since then we started with one plant. Since then we've 1:37 1 minute, 37 seconds had four manufacturing plants. Uh we have 14 acres of land. uh among these four manufacturing plants. Total 75% of 1:45 1 minute, 45 seconds the entire wagon body as well as the coach body is put together. Everything is manufactured under these four roofs. 1:51 1 minute, 51 seconds Uh the total uh order book that we are carrying right now is 760 crores which is divided into two parts. Uh the infrastructure items as well as the 1:59 1 minute, 59 seconds railway items. Uh the total installed capacity as on date is 1 lakh 33,600 metric tonses. The installed capacity standalone for cosmic CRF alone in a 2:08 2 minutes, 8 seconds single plant along with its uh ancillaries is 55,000 metric tons peranom and we have 65,000 metric tons 2:16 2 minutes, 16 seconds peranom which is the installed capacity of NS engineering projects private limited. We'll come to uh the slide which showcased about what NS 2:23 2 minutes, 23 seconds engineering has done and and how we have scaled up to this point because it is abnormal in in in certain ways to scale up a plant which did not have a capacity of more than 12,000 metric tons. 2:32 2 minutes, 32 seconds However, uh 13,600 metric tonses peranom is the installed capacity of the fourth of the third company which has two units. One is the forging unit and one 2:41 2 minutes, 41 seconds is the spring unit. Uh both these units are in this area called Jungapur which is an industrial estate in West Bengal. 2:47 2 minutes, 47 seconds And both of them put together uh carry out roughly 2 acres of land. Uh they both are individual assets but in the 2:54 2 minutes, 54 seconds same company called Cosmic Springs and Engineers which is a wholly owned subsidiary. We have one state-of-the-art galvanizing unit for which one of the 3:02 3 minutes, 2 seconds main reasons why we actually stepped into uh buying out NSG projects private limited. The volume growth since last year on year-to-year basis has been 19%. 3:12 3 minutes, 12 seconds The 94% growth in installed capacity has happened over the last one year and the entire capacity utilization is 80%. 3:20 3 minutes, 20 seconds Somebody asked me today itself that why 80%. And why uh do we want to scale further if you've just done 80% and wait 3:26 3 minutes, 26 seconds for 95% or 100%. The idea is very simple that when engineering plants like us where you have various steps and processes of manufacturing a particular 3:35 3 minutes, 35 seconds item, you practically find it very difficult to cross the threshold of 85 to 87%. However, we're doing our best to 3:43 3 minutes, 43 seconds cross uh 90% by next year of this install capacity and further on increase the install capacity to next to next year as well. So, next slide please. 3:56 3 minutes, 56 seconds Okay. So, the resilient growth of the company has happened over a period of uh time. Uh so, basically just the slide 4:04 4 minutes, 4 seconds before this is the chairman's uh uh address which is my personal address. I want to highlight a couple of points 4:11 4 minutes, 11 seconds which is brief of the entire uh entire uh you know deck that we are presenting to you guys today and out of which I'll just just touch the point and then we 4:20 4 minutes, 20 seconds can go into the slides. Uh the things that we've achieved this year is a massive asset uh turnover improvement that we've seen over the last few years. 4:28 4 minutes, 28 seconds This year has been great. uh there's a margin sustainability that we've been able to achieve which is great in size because the markets were not conducive 4:36 4 minutes, 36 seconds to the extent which used to be back in 23 24. Uh the execution has happened in scale and we have been tested because 4:43 4 minutes, 43 seconds see we come back from from we we come from a from a from a point of view where we have been able to execute 10,000 4:50 4 minutes, 50 seconds 20,000 30,000 metric tonses over the last few years maybe 50,000 last year but this year when we're talking about a one lakh 100,000 metric tons of 4:58 4 minutes, 58 seconds execution that's a lot keeping in mind that there are different items and not just one roof under which we are manufacturing everything or just one product for one sector it's various 5:06 5 minutes, 6 seconds sectors multiple sectors multiple products more than 3,000 SQS and multiple uh you know requirements from multiple vendors 5:15 5 minutes, 15 seconds at large. So there were the execution has been tested properly. Uh the order visibility is large. uh we have done 500 5:22 5 minutes, 22 seconds uh to 550 crores last year uh of order visibility at any point in go but we have started this year with 760 crores of order visibility thanks to NS 5:30 5 minutes, 30 seconds engineering projects private limited for the products that we have to supply for the infra that has allowed us to get the order book even more uh you know even 5:37 5 minutes, 37 seconds more robust uh yes we have Amazon in the books which is a great uh you know you know great achievement for all of us 5:45 5 minutes, 45 seconds back home in the office as well as for everybody all my shareholders as well uh that's something that we waited for and worked hard for for the last two two odd 5:52 5 minutes, 52 seconds years. Uh the subsidiary integration has happened very smoothly and we are further on trying to integrate more and more of these subsidiaries in the best 5:59 5 minutes, 59 seconds way possible to actually enhance the value of our shareholders and stakeholders. uh the cash conversions have also increased from last year though uh you know there are numbers 6:08 6 minutes, 8 seconds like 200 crores of trade receivables and payables and XYZ but you have to look at the number that has been achieved which is almost 80 to 90% or almost 100% 6:17 6 minutes, 17 seconds growth from what we used to do in in average uh last year and the debt has grown much lesser in size and when I say 6:24 6 minutes, 24 seconds that people have shown a lot of concern back home that you know uh the interest rates shot up from 6.6% 6% rates are 6:32 6 minutes, 32 seconds like the interest payment shot up from 6.6 crores last year in our consolidate book to almost 12.2 crores. But even 6:39 6 minutes, 39 seconds then you'll realize that it's only 16.9% of the top line and only 14.9% of the entire asset structure that you have. 6:47 6 minutes, 47 seconds However, that is that is very very uh you know you uh manageable in size. It's not at all a big uh amount and we will cover the breakup of that point when we 6:56 6 minutes, 56 seconds reach that slide. Particularly the last few points that I want to mention is that we have been able to scale very high and very fast and that is why I'm 7:04 7 minutes, 4 seconds very very thankful to my entire team which has put in day and night's effort and they plan to do this for the next five to six years at least uh till we 7:11 7 minutes, 11 seconds are in the capex uh cycles. Uh along with that uh we also are very happy uh to introduce you to uh the fact that we 7:19 7 minutes, 19 seconds have also got a forging unit now uh which is on way on the way like it's it's underway in terms of construction and everything but we are very hopeful 7:26 7 minutes, 26 seconds by the next 9 months we will go into uh complete uh commercial productions for the same whenever we can go to the next slide. 7:36 7 minutes, 36 seconds So uh the promoter execution is the pretty much the same things that I've mentioned and uh you guys can go through these slides but in in in just three 7:43 7 minutes, 43 seconds lines uh CRF has enhanced its capacity by setting up two new sheds also which is a 6,000 ft² shed and 11,000 ft² shed. 7:51 7 minutes, 51 seconds They have made a proper capex of more than 30 odd kores over the year because they have had to install two new lines a cutting slitting line separately with all the EOT cranes and all the works. 8:01 8 minutes, 1 second Along with that the design ability has also improved with uh the entire R&D in space. The NS has ramped up from uh 8:09 8 minutes, 9 seconds 12,500 metric tons to 65,000 metric tons which is almost 304% growth which is massive and that's happened because u uh 8:17 8 minutes, 17 seconds you know we kind of planned this the moment we had taken this plant on. We always felt that the plant was underutilized because of the space that it used to have and the past promoter 8:26 8 minutes, 26 seconds with all due respect to him he I think was spreading out a lot of area for beautifification which we didn't need. 8:32 8 minutes, 32 seconds Uh we come from that school of thought where we believe that every square feet needs to be used for something that gives you an ROI in the long term at least. So that was the idea and we kind 8:40 8 minutes, 40 seconds of have built six uh proper bays of almost 20 thou 25 to 30,000 ft² each along with the seventh bay which is 8:47 8 minutes, 47 seconds almost a 50,000 ft² galvanizing bath area and that makes us a to a total of almost 2 lakh 15 to 2 lakh 20,000 ft² of 8:54 8 minutes, 54 seconds covered area in this entire structure and uh the six bays are specifically used so that we can handle one product 9:02 9 minutes, 2 seconds for one uh segment in that one bay. So for example we do crash barriers in one bay we do poles in one bay we do high 9:09 9 minutes, 9 seconds mast in one bay we do uh sheet piles in one bay coffer dams in one bay and then one bay is utilized for all fabrication 9:17 9 minutes, 17 seconds work and then the last bay is used for testing and for uh and for uh inspections at large and any sort of assemblies if required. Uh so this is 9:26 9 minutes, 26 seconds pretty much it. The spring business is something that we have done a BT against last year in 2025 early 2025. uh the 9:34 9 minutes, 34 seconds total BTA was costing us almost 20 crores because initially it was 10 crores but then we wanted to buy the land also because it doesn't make sense because any bank coming in or any 9:43 9 minutes, 43 seconds individual person coming in will want to buy the land and we getting a steel deal in the land itself. So we bought the land itself. Uh that total structure 9:50 9 minutes, 50 seconds became a 20 cr business uh 20 cr investment. The business will shoot up to with the forging and the spring business put together. We'll have a 9:59 9 minutes, 59 seconds forward book of roughly roughly 25,000 metric tons uh in capacity and the average selling price of those items 10:07 10 minutes, 7 seconds that we'll sell from there is roughly 140 to 150 rupees a kilo. That's 1 lakh 50,000 rupees a ton. So we can look at 10:14 10 minutes, 14 seconds 300 crores of 300 to 350 crores of top lines there itself. uh because uh you will have uh you know additional items 10:22 10 minutes, 22 seconds that you'll be putting in with the items that you'll be manufacturing because these items are used for uh specific items and inputs in the wagons and the 10:30 10 minutes, 30 seconds railways and those items are very high precision items. It's safety items and at the same time uh it is required by and it is manufactured also not in 10:38 10 minutes, 38 seconds plenty and at the same time it is a high value item. So it is uh given a lot of importance by the RDS on the railways. 10:45 10 minutes, 45 seconds So this is the major item and plus the percentage of profits there and the bottom lines will be much higher than the existing businesses that we're doing 10:51 10 minutes, 51 seconds today. The next slide we uh pretty much the same thing u quickly we'll just go through it in one or two 10:59 10 minutes, 59 seconds lines. So basically the CRF has had started with 12,000 metric tons in capacity uh went on to 24,000 metric 11:06 11 minutes, 6 seconds tons in capacity after we spent roughly 40 crores 20 crores from the 20 crores from the IPO that we had raised in 2023 11:15 11 minutes, 15 seconds and 20 crores from the acrruals as well as the promoter contributions went up to 45,000 last year and then this year 11:22 11 minutes, 22 seconds we've gone up to 55,000 uh with the investments that we were making and also from the acrals uh like I said 6,000 11,000 ft² shared with all 11:30 11 minutes, 30 seconds the R&D and the machinery works that we've done. Uh along with that the NCPL which is the NS Engine project private limited shot up to 65,000 from roughly 11:38 11 minutes, 38 seconds 12,500 we've written 20,000 because we pretty much accepted that we had achieved 20,000 in terms of operational capacity but our galvanizing bar was still not underway in proper shape. 11:48 11 minutes, 48 seconds Today it's doing roughly 24,000 metric tons in the entire year. So that was a big advantage that we done. uh we plan to scale up to roughly 85,000 metric tons in the given space that we have. 11:59 11 minutes, 59 seconds We've acquired a small piece of land right behind in the adjacent area of NS engine projects priv Limited and that 12:06 12 minutes, 6 seconds area will be the final area where the bath will further increase the galvanizing bath so that we can have more materials that we can manufacture 12:13 12 minutes, 13 seconds and then we can do the galvanizing bath also we don't have to go outside a shed to do the same. So that will add up almost 20 odd,000 from where we stand in 12:20 12 minutes, 20 seconds the installed capacity base. Uh then we have the cosmic spins and engineers after the inclusion and the startup of forging unit we will roughly have 25,000 12:30 12 minutes, 30 seconds metric tons in totality. Uh as on date we have roughly 13,000 metric tons from 4,000 metric tons last year which was 12:37 12 minutes, 37 seconds there. Uh so that was pretty much it. Uh the total capacity today stands at 1 lakh 33,600 metric tonses. The breakup is 55,000 metric tons and installed 12:46 12 minutes, 46 seconds capacity for standalone 65,000 metric tons for NSNG project limit and 13,600 metric tons for CSEN. The actual 12:54 12 minutes, 54 seconds production that we've achieved against the entire uh you know the capacity that we built was roughly 1 lakh 6,000 uh 370 13:01 13 minutes, 1 second metric tons against 55 to 56,000 metric tons last year which is roughly a 90% jump straight up in terms of volumes. 13:12 13 minutes, 12 seconds The financial key highlights the one point that I would want want to state more than anything you can you guys can read this through. This is more literature than than I please and I like 13:21 13 minutes, 21 seconds to talk about but this is something that you can talk about and read. Uh this is all important from the company's perspective but for the short corn call we don't have to go through everything 13:29 13 minutes, 29 seconds that comes on screen. The only one point on the slide that I would want to mention is uh last year a lot of people had given a lot raised a lot of uh you 13:36 13 minutes, 36 seconds know red flags on the fact that 90 crores out of 400 crores of topline was the cash flow negative in terms of sense of operations. So the cash flow from 13:45 13 minutes, 45 seconds operations was 90 crores in negative which has become three and a half crores positive. Now a lot of people are saying this is not much. This is not enough. It 13:52 13 minutes, 52 seconds was expected to be more but three months back I've had people telling me that you know you'll take two years to go get into a positive cash p uh uh from 14:00 14 minutes operation side. Uh we've done this with the with the thought process that uh we've been able to actually achieve this 14:08 14 minutes, 8 seconds uh basically because we've pushed hard for the 90 crores that was outstanding and was not coming into the books for quite some time. there was some 14:14 14 minutes, 14 seconds outstanding uh uh you know incomes that were supposed to come in the trade receivables uh to the tune of almost 40 14:22 14 minutes, 22 seconds 50 60 crores even in the last quarter last to last year well like 2025 March that balance sheet and we pushed hard if 14:30 14 minutes, 30 seconds you remember the first quarter if you see my my GST numbers also you'll see 120 crores was my top line on the first 14:37 14 minutes, 37 seconds quarter because we didn't have the uh rail wheels as well as we didn't have those kind of situations where the outflow was much lesser than the inflow. 14:44 14 minutes, 44 seconds Uh so the inflow was much faster than the outflow because we were not giving in or or you know pushing sales and pushing the tonnage that that point in 14:52 14 minutes, 52 seconds time. We were building the the procedures at that point in time. We could cover this entire 40 50 60 cr gap and eventually we were in a situation 15:00 15 minutes where we could uh mitigate and bring in more cash than the mo than the cash that we actually let out of our houses. The next slide. 15:10 15 minutes, 10 seconds Okay. So this slide basically talks about a couple of things in in in Japose but let's just touch the base uh again 15:18 15 minutes, 18 seconds the cash flow which is a point that needed to be uh spoken about we've gone positive in operations in just 3 years of being alive in this market and just 15:26 15 minutes, 26 seconds you know within the 3 years of our existence. Uh there's a rapid asset integration that's been happening. My concept about asset integration has been 15:34 15 minutes, 34 seconds very simple from day one. We've tried to have have a backward and a forward integration in a word go so that the day we are calling ourselves or or in 15:42 15 minutes, 42 seconds standing in a situation where we can manufacture wagons and coaches together we don't have to actually go to people's houses and beg borrow steel for the 15:50 15 minutes, 50 seconds items and the components for which 90% of the wagon builders face the issue because 90% of the wagon builders you know if if said be they have capacities 15:59 15 minutes, 59 seconds of 500 400 600 wagons per month but they are not in a position to manufacture 200 300 wagons at an average also. The reason is very simple. You need more 16:07 16 minutes, 7 seconds than optin number of components more than 1,500 to 2,000 components small big size all sizes components and those components when they come in you have to 16:16 16 minutes, 16 seconds go to literally 20 30 50 vendors and then get those components from different different workshops different factories different MSME units and that becomes a 16:24 16 minutes, 24 seconds huge challenge till such time you don't get a kit for making a wagon even a even one hug bolt missing will not allow you to get the DM and your money will get 16:32 16 minutes, 32 seconds stuck so that there's a cash flow issue then there that happens for me this was most important because profit center can be one but the rest of the centers don't 16:40 16 minutes, 40 seconds have to be cost center but you need uh that kind of backup in terms of backward integration to be a successful wagon builder at large. We can't go the other way around for me because now the wagon 16:49 16 minutes, 49 seconds building industry has seen the upside of 70,000 to 90,000 bags coming in in 202122. 16:54 16 minutes, 54 seconds So we will not be having the time to wait uh to rebuild our uh you know ourselves against the industry because the industry will move faster than what 17:02 17 minutes, 2 seconds we believe in. Uh the third point was the R&D which is absolutely impeccable in our in my eyes because otherwise we won't be able to do almost 3,500 SQS in 17:10 17 minutes, 10 seconds various segments. The high utilization focus obviously we've been doing 80 to 85% of the utilizations. Uh there's a disciplined NCT that's happened. Si this 17:19 17 minutes, 19 seconds is this is a topic that we'll talk about in length on also a lot of people here in this in this uh conall will want to know about uh the the the experience 17:27 17 minutes, 27 seconds that we've had over the last one and a half to two years and a lot of things have been said a lot of things have been uh you know speculated we will put all 17:34 17 minutes, 34 seconds of them to rest today uh that was one thing that we won and today we can with all the grace of the go almighty we can we can say that yes uh we've been able 17:42 17 minutes, 42 seconds to achieve the success through hard work and through a proper strategy and not being in the wrong side of law. Uh most importantly there is an LOI that's 17:50 17 minutes, 50 seconds pending from the AMS and that's going to be the the the highest point of my career at least and also for Cosmic 17:57 17 minutes, 57 seconds CRF's uh you know run till now. Uh along with that uh for NS engineering we plan to bring the entire 26% that has been 18:06 18 minutes, 6 seconds outside because cosmic holds to 74% of the NS engineering and 26% is held by a couple of investors in group companies. 18:14 18 minutes, 14 seconds Uh basically why because when co when NS engineering was being bid for by Cosmic CRF in 2024 Cosmic CRF did not have the 18:22 18 minutes, 22 seconds net worth of 50 crores. So in 2023 we had to put in our papers right after right before the uh before the IPO and 18:30 18 minutes, 30 seconds we did not have the net worth. So they asked us to bring in some people to make a consortium and for the consortium we had to give 25 26% to the consortium 18:38 18 minutes, 38 seconds partners and due to which that is outside the periphery of cosmic which we plan to bring in so that we can consolidate the entire holding in the 18:46 18 minutes, 46 seconds company that owns NS engineering projects private limited. Uh along with that uh there is a huge uh you know fungeability and a versatility in the in 18:55 18 minutes, 55 seconds the uh you know in the procedures that we manufacture products with today. NS engineing projects private limited is an 19:01 19 minutes, 1 second infra unit prime prime of AC and single unit of cosmic CRF the primary unit is a railway unit but however both these 19:10 19 minutes, 10 seconds units are made in such a way with the rolling strength and with the galvanizing strength with the fabrication strength with all the works around it that 80% of the of the entire 19:20 19 minutes, 20 seconds strength can be converted to infra and 75% of the entire strength can be converted to railway whenever and whenever wherever required so if 19:28 19 minutes, 28 seconds tomorrow anybody feels that infra is going to have a slowdown because all of them are cycled to a certain extent. So once it's cyclical in nature like today we've seen a the loss of tailwind in the 19:37 19 minutes, 37 seconds railways over the last one one and a half years but there's no point in crying over spilled milk because we all know it's cyclical in nature. It's India after all. So we realize that we have to 19:46 19 minutes, 46 seconds have some sort of thought process to build and actually manage this entire uh leverage point of of managing on two scales and that's what I've been 19:54 19 minutes, 54 seconds speaking about over the years. Uh so this is the strength that we have tomorrow if god forbid infra goes into a sl kind of a slump or maybe a cyclical 20:01 20 minutes, 1 second slowdown for maybe two three years or maybe a year or maybe no but whatever at that point in time we can completely convert to the requirement of the 20:09 20 minutes, 9 seconds railways either one will work that is for certain because obviously the government has a huge focus on spending on both these infra points that's 20:16 20 minutes, 16 seconds railways and infra projects at large uh put together we have pretty much spoken about everything about about the tonnage and everything so when we can go to the 20:27 20 minutes, 27 seconds Uh this is about us transforming from CRF section manufacturers to a complete ecosystem. Today to manufacture a wagon you need pretty much five main things. 20:38 20 minutes, 38 seconds The wheel set which no one manufactures today practically Jupiter assembles to the best of my understanding even if it manufactures we still buy majority of 20:46 20 minutes, 46 seconds our wheel sets uh from Kapoor Tala and majority of the times we might be importing it also. So at any point in time wheel sets is not a con you know 20:55 20 minutes, 55 seconds not something that we have to consciously think about. It's available to everybody at the same price. The steel is sold by Tata Jindal and uh sale 21:03 21 minutes, 3 seconds at the similar prices at the same prices just 500 rupees here and there or,000 rupees here and there depends on the quantity that you buy. Uh and it's 21:11 21 minutes, 11 seconds widely uh available and I we've been also buying it over the last four to five years. So that's not not a problem if you remember uh like you know if you 21:18 21 minutes, 18 seconds if you kind of uh remove those two units. So the other than that you need CRFs, you need the nonDM items, you need 21:26 21 minutes, 26 seconds DM items. DM means uh the dispatch memo items and also the items that are under the periphery of the inspection of the RDSO or its related or approved bodies. 21:37 21 minutes, 37 seconds So the DM items or nonDM items which is fabricated in nature uh we are manufacturing them as well. Uh the CRF at large which we are proficient in. Uh 21:46 21 minutes, 46 seconds then you have the other fabrication parts which can be done in NS as well as singur. Other than that you have the springs which is required for your bogis 21:55 21 minutes, 55 seconds and for your suspensions and then you have your forging items. A lot of these casting items have been converted to forgings and casting yes I I I often 22:05 22 minutes, 5 seconds feel that if we have one casting unit in this entire portfolio there is nothing else I'd be left with. So yes we are now converting ourselves from CRF section 22:13 22 minutes, 13 seconds unit alone to a fully integrated uh wagon ecosystem that we can build on. 22:19 22 minutes, 19 seconds Yeah. The next Yes. The favorite side that everybody want to talk about. Uh something that I 22:26 22 minutes, 26 seconds also wanted to mention. Thankfully, we we achieved what we had to. Uh this battle started in 2025. Uh 2025 was 22:35 22 minutes, 35 seconds about uh uh fact that we were approving we were approaching the COC members and the RP at Amzen Transportation 22:43 22 minutes, 43 seconds Industries Private Limited. um subsidiary, one of the largest subsidiaries of Antech Auto and a company that was initially called Amtech 22:50 22 minutes, 50 seconds Rail Car built by the JV of Ant and American Rail Car. Uh it however went into the NCT for various reasons that 22:57 22 minutes, 57 seconds the Amttech Auto promoters were involved in. However, that's not the conversation we want to get into. The conversation that we must have is we bid for it. We 23:05 23 minutes, 5 seconds became H1. Post that the bidding stopped and then came allegations allegations of me individually with my family being 23:13 23 minutes, 13 seconds under the pretense of uh and and then debard from the process of CRP and the NCRT under section 29A A2H. Eventually 23:22 23 minutes, 22 seconds there were a lot of reports being shared. A lot of people took a participation in actually blaming us for having participated in such places where 23:29 23 minutes, 29 seconds we are not eligible and the NC got a chance to hear us out. NCT gave us a verdict where we were through and we 23:36 23 minutes, 36 seconds were given a chance to pro you know proceed with the CRP procedure. However, again the H2 bidder with its uh with his 23:43 23 minutes, 43 seconds uh you know members and and friends and family probably uh stepped in and again filed a case against us in the ENCLAT. 23:50 23 minutes, 50 seconds This happened in January and February 2025 and that came as a shock to us and we were suddenly having to proceed with the 23:57 23 minutes, 57 seconds ENCLAT uh submissions. The enclad submissions went on till a May and June. 24:03 24 minutes, 3 seconds Again that point in time we were stopped uh throughout the process and after 2 weeks or 3 weeks there was an order that came out. After a month that there was 24:10 24 minutes, 10 seconds an order that came out and that said that I was ineligible that ineligibility stood on my ground. I went with my team 24:18 24 minutes, 18 seconds to the Supreme Court and asked for uh a chance to be able to you know explain the ENCLAD how they're wrong with uh 24:26 24 minutes, 26 seconds understanding or or interpreting the law and I'm not ineligible to which Supreme Court gave us a chance. They sent us back to the ENCLAT. The ENCLAD heard us 24:35 24 minutes, 35 seconds again over seven months and eight hearings. We I could not uh convince the ENCLAD for some reason or the other for 24:42 24 minutes, 42 seconds whatever reasons best known to ENCLAD and God we were not uh eligible at that point in time and the order was pretty uh auditiously against me uh which said 24:51 24 minutes, 51 seconds that I am not eligible at the same time it was posted to the C uh to the to the IBBI for investigations and things like 24:58 24 minutes, 58 seconds that. However, we saw complete uh you know uh there's a problem. There's a problem with the order. There's a 194 25:05 25 minutes, 5 seconds page order which which did not make sense to me at all to a certain extent and with the law that I understand and my team understands and my councils understand. Again, we went to the 25:14 25 minutes, 14 seconds Supreme Court and under the under the guidance of the honorable Supreme Court, we filed all our uh documents. We filed 25:21 25 minutes, 21 seconds all the all the all the papers and all the submissions were made. The applications were made after three hearings by God's grace uh we were 25:30 25 minutes, 30 seconds declared as eligible. The order said by the enclability, the fact that there was a new form G 25:39 25 minutes, 39 seconds where new players would come in and bid for it which they did and then the fact that uh you know they can go ahead with 25:47 25 minutes, 47 seconds uh you know going ahead with the CRP process with the new players as I was ineligible was set aside in in totality. 25:54 25 minutes, 54 seconds So the the asset the the entire order of the ENCLAT along with its investigational requirements from the IBBI was set aside and there was nothing 26:02 26 minutes, 2 seconds that was kept back from the ENCLAT. So that was a clean order that was given to us. I was stated as eligible and to be taking part in the CRP process of any of 26:10 26 minutes, 10 seconds the companies along with most importantly Amsen transportation and then further on this further leads to me now being the only H1 and we are 26:18 26 minutes, 18 seconds awaiting the COC uh that should happen any point in time and moment COC happens by God's grace we will achieve the LOI 26:26 26 minutes, 26 seconds where we'll make the payment and we'll take over the asset. So uh this is something that is that is a big big big move for us and it's uh god-given and at 26:34 26 minutes, 34 seconds the same time congratulations to all the stakeholders also for uh being able to take over something like this. Believe me uh when this asset starts in 26:43 26 minutes, 43 seconds production you all are invited to come and see this asset. I saw it for the first time. I've seen all the railway assets and believe me this is something 26:50 26 minutes, 50 seconds that you'll fall in love with. It is not something that that we often see in India an asset like this. So that that is what it was pretty much. This is what 26:59 26 minutes, 59 seconds the overall thing is. Just two more things about the Samsung asset. It is into three businesses not just wagon manufacturing. It manufactures all types 27:06 27 minutes, 6 seconds of wagons starting from open top covered wagons and most of the wagons that they they have licenses for all wagons. Plus uh they are also into the manufacturing 27:15 27 minutes, 15 seconds of bridge guarders and bridge fabricate fabricated items to the tune of 20,000 metric tons as per RDSO and RDS approved 27:22 27 minutes, 22 seconds as well. And also they have the strength of putting in capeex and rising from 3600 wagon capacity peranom to 7200 27:30 27 minutes, 30 seconds wagon capacity which gets it to almost 600 wagons per month because they have the DFCC line also parallel running par running running parallelly to the to the 27:39 27 minutes, 39 seconds asset. Along with that they have almost one and a half kilometers of uh internal siding and they also have the northern IR the northern rail line also for the 27:47 27 minutes, 47 seconds Indian railways running parallel to the DFCC right beside them. So it's a beautiful asset and it is absolutely on the point like 27:57 27 minutes, 57 seconds we would have had to take years to build something like this. Along with that we are also planning to move into manufacturing of containers and there's 28:05 28 minutes, 5 seconds a reason for that. The reason is you need similar amount of uh equipments, machinery to manufacture seaf containers 28:11 28 minutes, 11 seconds that you need to build pretty much all the items that are mentioned in the Amazon portfolio. So we'll get into that as well because there were massive space there and we'll be able to manage that. 28:20 28 minutes, 20 seconds So that'll add to the top lines and bottom lines also and the product diversity. So that's pretty much about Amazon and we can go into uh the questions whenever we want to once we 28:28 28 minutes, 28 seconds finish the entire layout. So um um we can just go to the next slide please. 28:34 28 minutes, 34 seconds Uh the key financial highlights on the consolidated balance sheets and the top lines were the revenue uh basically uh 28:41 28 minutes, 41 seconds shot up on the half yearly 26 uh the second half basically shot up from 232 to 2412 which is 77% in year-on-year 28:48 28 minutes, 48 seconds growth. Uh the IITA shot up by 81% year-on-year and net profit shot up by 128%. 28:55 28 minutes, 55 seconds The next one uh the revenues uh in consolidated in year-to-year basis shot up by 78% 29:03 29 minutes, 3 seconds year-on-year. The beta shot up by 77% and the net profit shot up by 74%. 29:10 29 minutes, 10 seconds The key highlights like I mentioned was 1 lakh 30,600 metric tons in install capacity. 1 lakh 6,370 is what we've achieved in cosmic springs and engineers 29:19 29 minutes, 19 seconds in uh cosmic CRF standalone as well as an NS engine project together with an order book pending now for central 60 29:25 29 minutes, 25 seconds cross the actual productions that have happened away from the installed capacity that we've been talking about 29:33 29 minutes, 33 seconds is 42,690 metric tons. There's one question that I asked myself and I would like to also answer this to you even without you guys asking me that with 29:41 29 minutes, 41 seconds 55,000 metric tons of capacity why would you only do 42 690 metric tons. Uh the only answer to that is that we've achieved the capacity. So you know when 29:49 29 minutes, 49 seconds you achieve the capacity it's not like you this year we should do uh if order books are great and everything execution goes fine uh you should touch roughly 88 29:58 29 minutes, 58 seconds 89% which is roughly 48 to 50,000 tons in in totality in standalone. uh the NS engine project limit is 56,380 out of 30:07 30 minutes, 7 seconds 65,000 and NS CSCL is 78300 from the 13,000 the reason is very simple we are awaiting the RDSO license we have 30:16 30 minutes, 16 seconds already finished 75% of our uh testing periods that have been done hopefully fingers crossed if everything goes smoothly by God's grace we will be able 30:23 30 minutes, 23 seconds to achieve the RDSO uh approvals uh by next month uh the capacity expansions for growth is 30:32 30 minutes, 32 seconds uh simple the dedicated fat corridor items uh for the heavy bridges and the road overs as well as the bridges the bridge parts have all been a part of the 30:41 30 minutes, 41 seconds things that we want to grow into with the assets that we are building onto uh specifically Amazon Amazon will have a lot of space and a lot of equipment that 30:49 30 minutes, 49 seconds will enable us and the uh licenses to build these things also NS can also help us in some bit or the other in the these 30:57 30 minutes, 57 seconds products the forge components obviously will come through the forging unit that we are setting up it's also going to be a state art facility and it's going to 31:04 31 minutes, 4 seconds be set up in the next 9 months. Along with that, the cast springs that we are talking about over the last one and a half odd years. The spring unit is set up now. The spring unit has only been 31:13 31 minutes, 13 seconds delayed because of the RDSO license that has been pending. Uh but that that is something that anybody from the railway departments or anybody uh who has been 31:20 31 minutes, 20 seconds in railway businesses will understand that this is something that is a challenge because this is an industry that doesn't want quick entries. And when I say that's an advantage for you 31:29 31 minutes, 29 seconds being a CRF unit, that's an advantage for them as well. But because you've been in the railway business and your family's been in the railway business for quite some time, uh you've been able 31:37 31 minutes, 37 seconds to make uh headwinds towards it. Uh plus like I said a liquid metal initiative is something that we've been talking about 31:45 31 minutes, 45 seconds over the last one year. Um Amazon is something that I wanted to complete first once I do complete Amazon and this 31:51 31 minutes, 51 seconds will be our next uh point of attraction a point of uh you know complete focus and we will get a liquid metal 31:58 31 minutes, 58 seconds initiative inside a liquid metal unit inside the entire 4A of our products inside cosmic CRF as one of our 32:06 32 minutes, 6 seconds subsidiaries the future items of the existing units like 7500 containers of 20 ft 40 ft the capacity should be 10,000 I hope we'll be able to do 8 and 32:15 32 minutes, 15 seconds a half to 9,000 But let's say 7500 will be fair to say right now the R&D is done towards it and the R&D for the defense 32:22 32 minutes, 22 seconds sector starting from the wagons required for the defense along with the export wagons the wagons that are required for 32:30 32 minutes, 30 seconds defense in the exports will also be touched and some parts and some components that we manufacture in some other companies in smaller quantities 32:38 32 minutes, 38 seconds which is outside the periphery of cosmic CRF will also be brought in inside Amazon. The wagons today as we have the 32:45 32 minutes, 45 seconds licenses that need to be reinstated uh will be 3,600 which further if capex into over the next two years will go up 32:53 32 minutes, 53 seconds to 7200. Repair and maintenance of wagons is a big business. We have four lakh wagons on the tracks today out of which one and a half lakh wagons have 33:00 33 minutes roughly 12 to 16 years before it go comes into uh repairs but we still have two and a half lakh wagons which needs constant repairs. So that is something 33:08 33 minutes, 8 seconds that will also be a part of it, part of our journey, part of our uh top lines, part of our revenue streams, part of our uh workability also because uh in the 33:16 33 minutes, 16 seconds northern rail lines we don't have many many players compared to the eastern rail lines where where we have almost eight wagon builders. We have very few wagon builders there and uh we'll be one 33:24 33 minutes, 24 seconds of the largest ones there standing and sitting and doing work there. So this is also one of the revenue shields that we'll be touching base on. 33:33 33 minutes, 33 seconds uh the way forward like I said is uh we will be able to uh do 1 lakh 75,000 metric tons in totality with NS 33:42 33 minutes, 42 seconds engineering in totality in in in terms of volume with NS engineering with cosmix CRF with cosmic springs and engineers forging division and spring 33:51 33 minutes, 51 seconds division we have done we have already installed 1 lakh 33,600 metric tons in capacity and which will go up to 1 lakh 33:58 33 minutes, 58 seconds 75,000 metric tons in capacity however 1 lakh 70,000 75,000 to 1 lakh 90,000 metric tons and capacity depends on the 34:05 34 minutes, 5 seconds efficiency depends on uh any other land asset machinery that we come across over the years next to one and a half to two years however [clears throat] when we 34:13 34 minutes, 13 seconds look at this 65 in standalone capacity 65,000 tons will be achieved in CCL say 85,000 metric tons will be achieved in 34:20 34 minutes, 20 seconds NCPL and 25,000 metric tons in CCL by the next 12 to 15 odd months post that 34:27 34 minutes, 27 seconds when we talk about 12% volume growth when we talk about 27x volume growth 12% as 12x volume growth, 27x volume growth. 34:35 34 minutes, 35 seconds The math is very simple. We take our starting point from 12,000 metric tons in CRF when we started to today where we 34:43 34 minutes, 43 seconds are talking about 1 lakh 35 1 lakh 40,000 metric tons which is almost 12x to uh roughly with 1 lakh 50,000 metric 34:51 34 minutes, 51 seconds tons of capacity coming in with Amzen you can talk about 27x because you'll be touching 350,000 350,000 metric tons 34:59 34 minutes, 59 seconds peranom in capacity in fabrications and in in in productions. So this is pretty much it. The rest of the ones you guys can read it up. You can go to the next. 35:12 35 minutes, 12 seconds So our journey till now like I've said is 2021 we started in December. Uh 2022 we kind of took over the asset of Cosmic 35:19 35 minutes, 19 seconds CRF and uh we got ourselves listed in 2023. 2024 we took over NS. 2025 we finished our BTA. We also got into 35:28 35 minutes, 28 seconds forgings. We also got into capacity enhancements and we also bid for Mson. 35:34 35 minutes, 34 seconds The next one I think someone raised a hand. I think that's okay. Uh should we move on to the Q&A now? 35:43 35 minutes, 43 seconds How many slides do we have left? If if people want we can go on to the Q&A because the rest is all uh you know it's all uh literature people can read. So it's okay we can. 35:53 35 minutes, 53 seconds Yeah. So we'll move to the Q&A now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 36:00 36 minutes Participants who wish to ask a question we use the option of raise hand. We'll take the first question from Vimmel Gohill. Vimmel, you can go ahead please. 36:11 36 minutes, 11 seconds Yeah, thanks uh thank you so much for the opportunity. I have two questions. 36:15 36 minutes, 15 seconds One is a data point one. If you can help us uh with the revenue and volumes of springs and forgings uh the breakup for 36:24 36 minutes, 24 seconds F26 that will help. So we we already have that u in the volumes on in springs 36:32 36 minutes, 32 seconds we have done roughly 2300 uh tons if I'm not wrong in totality the total with fabrication in steel is roughly 4,000 to 36:40 36 minutes, 40 seconds 5,000 odd metric tons uh in totality if you see uh our install capacity today stands at 13,600 metric tonses and we've 36:49 36 minutes, 49 seconds been able to achieve 4 and a half to 5,000 metric tons in FI27 this will go up to somewhere around 10 to 12,000 36:56 36 minutes, 56 seconds metric tons by FI 28 you will be achieving roughly 22 to 23,000 metric 23,000 metric tons in totality. 37:05 37 minutes, 5 seconds So uh the break the for for springs for F26 you've done 2300 metric tons is that correct? 37:11 37 minutes, 11 seconds So we've done roughly 2300 metric tons and some fabrications as well totality we've done a totality of 37:18 37 minutes, 18 seconds roughly 400 metric tons 2300 is a springs and the rest is fabricated steel basically fabrication. 37:25 37 minutes, 25 seconds Right. Right. We've not we've not done coaching yet because coaching is not started yet. 37:32 37 minutes, 32 seconds Fair enough. So basically I'll take 4,500 as our total volume. Yeah, you can do that. 37:38 37 minutes, 38 seconds Understood. Understood. And uh uh and the revenue thereof for spring, how much would that be? 67 crores. 37:47 37 minutes, 47 seconds 67. Yeah. 37:49 37 minutes, 49 seconds And uh sir, if you can just comment on uh the margins because we saw some dilution this half. 37:56 37 minutes, 56 seconds uh you know of course raw material prices are under pressure somewhat uh because of the Rome prices what is 38:03 38 minutes, 3 seconds the pass through that you're looking at in uh looking to achieve in7 38:11 38 minutes, 11 seconds you raised a super point actually I'll tell you what happened in that 67 crores we've only made a cr and a half that's it the reason is very 38:19 38 minutes, 19 seconds simple though that industry gives you a turnout of more than 50 odd percent but till such time you don't have the RDS or You're selling to only traders and to 38:27 38 minutes, 27 seconds players in the market who don't need RDSO stampings and who need these basic springs for other purposes. You're actually not officially selling to the railways or the wagon builders at all. 38:37 38 minutes, 37 seconds And these springs are actually bought by wagon builders as well as by bogy builders because they set it up. It's one of the components of the bogies, right? So just before you set up the 38:45 38 minutes, 45 seconds wheel sets. So the idea is the moment you get the license which I said which we should get by next month hopefully your percentage margins on the first part will shoot up to approximately 10%. 38:57 38 minutes, 57 seconds And then going up to almost 15 to 18% and I'm talking about pat I'm not talking about so that's effectively the cost the spring business 39:06 39 minutes, 6 seconds has not made any ea because we've not supplied to the railway directly is what you're saying. Yeah, we could not actually. What was the issue? The issue 39:13 39 minutes, 13 seconds was that we wanted once you set up the furnaces and once you have the furnace oil put in, you have the entire team there. If you do not run the flush show 39:21 39 minutes, 21 seconds for whatever it's worth, then the team will leave you and go and getting these teams is a very big challenge here challenge. So the issue was that we had 39:29 39 minutes, 29 seconds to keep the plant rolling and running from day one. We've been waiting for the license for over six to eight months. 39:34 39 minutes, 34 seconds And this has been a story if you ask anybody in the departments of spring in RDS Lacno or in Kolkata they'll tell you that there are more than four parties 39:42 39 minutes, 42 seconds out of which two parties have given up two parties out of which one is me one is another ex party who is also wagon builder who's trying to sort of start 39:48 39 minutes, 48 seconds set up spring. So we two have been at it and we we two are the only ones who've been put into testing after eight months of uh trials. So that's been a challenge 39:56 39 minutes, 56 seconds which we've been facing over the last six to eight months. That's one point. 40:00 40 minutes So that's weighed into the top lines and bottom lines. There's one more reason you know I'll tell you what has happened. So last year when we to look at the numbers in consolidation we look at 29 crores against 401. Right. 40:12 40 minutes, 12 seconds Right. So now just just what we can do with that math is just remove 5.9 crores 40:20 40 minutes, 20 seconds from that math. I'll do the math with you over here. So if you remove 5.9 crores from just give me a second. Uh so 40:28 40 minutes, 28 seconds I done it somewhere. So fair enough. So basically 29 crores minus 5.9 crores 40:35 40 minutes, 35 seconds which is the exceptional profit that you gained from the NS take over right add 1 cr because you would have had to pay the 40:42 40 minutes, 42 seconds tax for it so roughly you're at 24.1 crores of top line of bottom line of pat divided by 401 you were at actually 6% 40:51 40 minutes, 51 seconds and not 8 and a half%. Coming back to this year you have had to do 50.6 six roughly and then you are doing roughly 41:00 41 minutes against 722 which is making you look at 7% on PAT. Now there's a reason why we have lost out 8 crores on the bottom 41:08 41 minutes, 8 seconds line. What is the reason? There were three main reasons. One is the spring business weighed you down because of the average profitability 67 crores 41:17 41 minutes, 17 seconds which has brought you down to a certain extent the average weighted averages. 41:21 41 minutes, 21 seconds Point two is you had to carry out or carry that load of the entire Amzen belt strength for the last nine months 41:29 41 minutes, 29 seconds because these guys are all KMPS that you had to take from various wagon builders which once left if you leave them today they'll go back and then tomorrow they 41:37 41 minutes, 37 seconds might not you might not find the right fits for the for the Amson. So you have to carry them. So I was prepared to be in a position to take over Amson when we 41:45 41 minutes, 45 seconds were doing pre last year so that we could have gone and done it once in a in one go. But however you know the situation that we had go had to go 41:52 41 minutes, 52 seconds through because of legal issues. Thus we carried them which is a cost of almost two two and a half crores that weighed us down. The third was again which is 42:00 42 minutes the cost that we had to bear for the legal issues. My auditors did not allow me toex it or put it on on escro forms 42:08 42 minutes, 8 seconds to pay it to us. They said on a joial note but reality is that CRF 42:16 42 minutes, 16 seconds was the is the owner of Amson and they had to pay for the entire legal rights. 42:19 42 minutes, 19 seconds Also there was a slight clause around it that the offer that that the that the case did not say uh takeover of Amazon. 42:26 42 minutes, 26 seconds It said myotic versus cosmic CRF for which it's a battle that cosmic CRF has to fight and there's no way we can capex 42:33 42 minutes, 33 seconds it in our in our cost. So that cost also weighed us down totality in totality we lost out 8 crores on the bottom line because of the added added expenditures 42:42 42 minutes, 42 seconds that we have to make almost of 10 crores on the on the expenditure base. 42:48 42 minutes, 48 seconds Fair enough. Uh thank you. Thank you so much for the clarity. All the best. 42:53 42 minutes, 53 seconds Thank you. We'll take the next question from Aron Rama Badran. Please go ahead. 43:05 43 minutes, 5 seconds Arun. Yeah. Hello. You can hear me? Yes. Yes. Can I can hear you? 43:09 43 minutes, 9 seconds Yeah. Yeah. Hi. Hi, sir. Firstly, many congratulations on the Amza win. So, I think this is what some everybody all of us were waiting for. So it's a huge win 43:17 43 minutes, 17 seconds for all of us. So many many congratulations. Yeah. 43:20 43 minutes, 20 seconds Congrat Yeah. Thank you sir. 43:23 43 minutes, 23 seconds Thank you. Uh one quick question relating to this. So the order says that we have won the this thing right like uh 43:30 43 minutes, 30 seconds the right to be bidding but it doesn't say that uh I mean does it mean that uh it can I mean nobody can bid again for 43:38 43 minutes, 38 seconds this? I mean we we will be the only bidder or I mean this closes the chapter or could there be any loophole in this? 43:45 43 minutes, 45 seconds Okay. So I'll explain this to you. So the order will always say what you have asked for. So for example, if you ask the court that sir I am not ineligible 43:54 43 minutes, 54 seconds as per 29A. So my eligibility needs to be proven and the process that's been taken up by or been asked to or been instructed by the ENCLA needs to stop. 44:04 44 minutes, 4 seconds So that is why Supreme Court first after the first round of hearing gave you a stay on the on the on on the process 44:11 44 minutes, 11 seconds that was going around on the second round of bidding for against which the form G's were out and the offers were also in. Okay. Point two, you asked for 44:20 44 minutes, 20 seconds 20A. Supreme Court believed that yes, you are okay and you're good to go for it. So 20NA was gifted to you back that yes, you are not in ineligible against under 20NA law and you can go and pit. 44:32 44 minutes, 32 seconds Now these two points put together you back into the trance of 0.1 which is on the day Enclad came into the picture and 44:41 44 minutes, 41 seconds actually asked you to step aside from the bidding that day you are the H1 bidder and the COC had approved you as 44:48 44 minutes, 48 seconds the H1 bidder. They asked you for a resolution plan, the final resolution plan which you submitted and you were in 44:55 44 minutes, 55 seconds the verge of basically you were in the terms of negotiation with the COC and the RP. That point in time this order of 45:03 45 minutes, 3 seconds ENCLAD came. So everything stops on that day. The law of the IBBI and the IBC says that anybody who is an H1 bidder if 45:11 45 minutes, 11 seconds he's not uh removed under the 29A pretense then will remain as the H1 45:18 45 minutes, 18 seconds bidder and will finally turn to become the resolution the final resolution applicant who takes over the asset. Now 45:26 45 minutes, 26 seconds if we take out the entire juncture or the entire episode of ENCLAT and you take it off and how do you take it off? 45:33 45 minutes, 33 seconds By asking the Supreme Court to set aside the order of the of the ENCLAT. Supreme Court did the same. But the honorable 45:40 45 minutes, 40 seconds Supreme Court set aside the order of the honorable ENCLAT. That means whatever ENCLAT ordered against you for you 45:47 45 minutes, 47 seconds against you against the procedure for the procedure whatever it was that 9 months is gone. So nothing in during 45:54 45 minutes, 54 seconds that order holds good. Thus the COC now as per the law book and as per the uh the means of the IBC needs to rewind 46:03 46 minutes, 3 seconds scrap out the entire form G and all the resolution plans that they received they need to give back the EMDs to the people 46:10 46 minutes, 10 seconds who have filed their resolution plans and come back to me and ask me for the final negotiation against the NY. That's 46:19 46 minutes, 19 seconds it. There is nothing else that can happen in this structure. Thanks a lot sir. This is very helpful. 46:27 46 minutes, 27 seconds Thank you for the detailed explanation and many many congratulations. Just one follow-up question sir. Um recently there is a change in uh the government 46:36 46 minutes, 36 seconds in West Bengal and there are lot of reports coming in that lot of expansion is going to happen in that way especially. So is there any uh 46:44 46 minutes, 44 seconds additional orders we are I mean we are thinking of like there could be I think metros or bullet trains or many new things that might be coming up very I 46:53 46 minutes, 53 seconds will I will not we have a certain amount number of things like just out of this context I'm telling you last Saturday and Sunday I've been with the government 47:01 47 minutes, 1 second officials only working on all this out believe me on a Sunday from 9:00 we were at the house of the decision makers and 47:09 47 minutes, 9 seconds deciding what like whether we can participate in these things or not are we will be participating in in a lot of them. uh that is one of the greater uh 47:17 47 minutes, 17 seconds greener cycle if if Amazon was not something that we that was not in our syllabus as of now then I would be talking about this change of the 47:24 47 minutes, 24 seconds government in in our in our state is only because after 40 years people are talking about growth stories and this government that has come in is a government that probably will have to 47:33 47 minutes, 33 seconds build Kolkata and West Bengal because the fact that there's a lot of scope of growth when you talk about a Bangalore or a Bombay or a Pune or a Chennai or 47:41 47 minutes, 41 seconds for that matter of fact a Delhi compared to a West Bengal any city comp including Kolkata there's a massive scope massive 47:48 47 minutes, 48 seconds scope of growth so uh you will have the items I'm telling you that will go in you'll have the poles and the high mass that will go in you'll have the angles 47:56 47 minutes, 56 seconds and structures that I'll be going in for fabricated steels for all the development that they'll be doing starting from metro to bridge building to crash barrier to NHI which is a 48:05 48 minutes, 5 seconds central body again the center is the one which is ruling west Bengal as on date today along with that the development of the entire Bengal at length will need 48:13 48 minutes, 13 seconds coffer damps you have the gang es here the dredging hasn't happened over the over the last two decades as far as I am concerned you don't have deeper ships 48:20 48 minutes, 20 seconds coming into the Bengal port ever because of the non-dredging item issues along with that you'll need the coffer dam 48:28 48 minutes, 28 seconds products you'll need the sheet piles you will need the crash barriers and the tested barriers and any sort of product that they will need for infra we can 48:35 48 minutes, 35 seconds build it with the with the uh you know uh with the pace of items that we have or the number of machines and the knowhow that we have about the 48:44 48 minutes, 44 seconds engineering of these products over the years. So we will be completely involved and there'll be constant updates that you guys will be getting regarding the orders that we'll be getting very soon 48:52 48 minutes, 52 seconds from the West Bengal government as well as the parties that'll be working with the West Bengal government, the larger players who will be giving orders to smaller subsidies like us. 49:05 49 minutes, 5 seconds Thank you. We'll move on to Hanu Rao. Please go ahead. 49:13 49 minutes, 13 seconds Hello sir, good evening. Hello. How are you? 49:16 49 minutes, 16 seconds I am good. I am good. Thank you sir. Uh first of all congrats for the positive judgment and next one more congrats for the good set of numbers. 49:27 49 minutes, 27 seconds Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. So I have two questions sir. Right. 49:31 49 minutes, 31 seconds So the first question is everyone is asking about Amazon. So with respect to MEN I just want to know the exact 49:38 49 minutes, 38 seconds timeline like preparation of the factory once you get the LOI and then your start production the timeline if you have any 49:46 49 minutes, 46 seconds guess of what ex how exactly it can happen that is the first question and second question is like uh previously we 49:54 49 minutes, 54 seconds have around 70 to 80 course of debt and right now we moved around 130 crores of 50:01 50 minutes, 1 second debt so going forward you have Amazon uh structuring and also some liquid assets. 50:10 50 minutes, 10 seconds So you have any other plans to take more debts or uh how you are well managing 50:18 50 minutes, 18 seconds how you want to manage the debt management I want to know. 50:21 50 minutes, 21 seconds Okay. So like I said when I started this conversation okay thank you I'll answer the debt part first and then we'll go into the Amazon bit. Okay that works. So 50:30 50 minutes, 30 seconds the idea is I was telling you about how uh you know right in the beginning of my conversation when I started the uh PPT I 50:39 50 minutes, 39 seconds said the debt even today is lighter when we compare it to the past year we kind of see that okay you know you have 6.6 50:48 50 minutes, 48 seconds crores of interest that you paid against 12.2 crores of interest this year. The reason is you had only 50 to 55 crores of debt last year and you were paying 50:56 50 minutes, 56 seconds 10.5% of interest. The interest is also a big issue here. The interest has happened because of uh Bank of India 51:05 51 minutes, 5 seconds which is one of the fin first banks that funded us. Now their cost of funding is much higher than SBI or any of the 51:12 51 minutes, 12 seconds scheduled banks for whatever reasons best known to their management. However, Bank of India today we could have let them go. We have lot of bankers who are 51:21 51 minutes, 21 seconds ready to come into Cosmic CRF and any of our companies. The reason why we didn't let them go is because of the assoc association that we've had a long-standing association with Bank of 51:29 51 minutes, 29 seconds India. And why did we have continuous association at a cost of 1 cr peranom for the last one and a half years is only because we believe that they 51:37 51 minutes, 37 seconds understand us very well. They've been working with us. They took a uh you know they took a shot with us when we were not so big and not so uh not so well 51:45 51 minutes, 45 seconds renowned. They are one of the main people who want to finance and fund uh Amazon also. So that is one of the reasons why we had them in the book. If 51:54 51 minutes, 54 seconds you remove that 1 cr goes out of your interest. Now we talk about 11 crores. 51:57 51 minutes, 57 seconds What is the breakup of your debt? Your debt breakup is the six crores that is due of the 20 crores that was taken to 52:04 52 minutes, 4 seconds take over CRF in 2022. [clears throat] That six that 20 crores is now standing 52:11 52 minutes, 11 seconds at 6 crores. Other than that you have 30 crores of debt that you took against NS Engineering Projects Private Limited. 52:18 52 minutes, 18 seconds You put in 75 crores. You took in a debt of 30 crores and that's about it. So your cost of the project was 105 odd crores in totality that 30 crores. So 52:27 52 minutes, 27 seconds put together your term loan is only standing at 36 crores against an asset book of more than 500 crores. Other than 52:34 52 minutes, 34 seconds that when you talk about the total debt in working capital you've pulled out 722 52:40 52 minutes, 40 seconds crores of topline with let's say 12% of uh IITA margins at most with 52:48 52 minutes, 48 seconds depreciation being added at 5 3% 4%. So let's say we remove 15% we're talking about 613 crores when you divide that 52:56 52 minutes, 56 seconds into an average turnaround ratio of my book which is 2.84% 2.84 84 times you're looking at roughly 53:04 53 minutes, 4 seconds a requirement of more than 220 crores of working capital to achieve 700 crores. 53:10 53 minutes, 10 seconds Now 220 crores of working capital I just have 84 crores of working capital with me from the scheduleled banks which is 53:16 53 minutes, 16 seconds SBI and Bank of India. That's it. And that fund is and I'm carrying on with with raw material, trade payables, 53:25 53 minutes, 25 seconds receivables all put together with a working capital of more than 200 crores which is funded by your acrals because you funded the the capex cycle through 53:34 53 minutes, 34 seconds your pref money through your IPO money through your uh interests that you regained and also through the uh through 53:42 53 minutes, 42 seconds through the through the interest and through the uh advances that you got from parties. You worked out the working capital bit from your own acruals. So 53:51 53 minutes, 51 seconds that is why your debt is so smaller in size compared to me any of our peers. 53:55 53 minutes, 55 seconds Everybody's working at 25 to 30% debt on the top line which is coming up to 150 odd crores at the minimum. Rest can be your margin. So at 150 crores we are 60 54:04 54 minutes, 4 seconds 80 crores short of what we were supposed to be what we should have taken in debt. But we that's why we are debt light. 54:10 54 minutes, 10 seconds Point one. Point two is if you compare your debt against your top line, it is only 16.8 to 16.9%. 54:18 54 minutes, 18 seconds If you compare your debt today, the total debt with the term loans which have been carried out from 22 onwards, you're looking at 14.9% of the total 54:26 54 minutes, 26 seconds asset book is your debt. So your debt is not actually heavy. It is actually lighter compared to any of your peers at at the word go. along against that today 54:35 54 minutes, 35 seconds if you do not if you wouldn't have wanted to grow at the scale that you're growing then you wouldn't have had to put springs uh your uh forgings and you 54:44 54 minutes, 44 seconds wouldn't have had to scale NSG engine to that level also you would have saved a lot of money at that point in time even if you wouldn't have raised your 160 crores and the pre and warrant of 51 54:53 54 minutes, 53 seconds crores also the 200 crores would have been out of which 36 crores is yet to come in so practically you have a book 55:00 55 minutes of cash which is 150 plus 20 crores that has been given on the outside as a plan B if Amazon would have been delayed. So 55:08 55 minutes, 8 seconds 170 crores of cash you're carrying against a debt of 80 crores working capital which is backed by all current 55:15 55 minutes, 15 seconds assets to the tune on the current asset today stands at roughly 200 crores and the term loan debt which is the actual 55:21 55 minutes, 21 seconds actual debt it's only 36 crores. If 36 cr divided by uh 555 so 36 divided by 55:29 55 minutes, 29 seconds 555 you're looking at uh 6% of your entire asset is just debt rest is all 55:36 55 minutes, 36 seconds your money your company's money so debt is not much now coming back to the second part of your requirement we go into Amazon is a project that will cost 55:45 55 minutes, 45 seconds you 400 odd crores give and take 10 crores here and there because you want to build it to 7,200 wagons or an that is the buildup ratio we'll not wait for 55:53 55 minutes, 53 seconds it You never waited, we won't wait for it because on a bad cycle if you build you'll make I mean you'll make hey while the sun shines when it's a good cycle 56:01 56 minutes, 1 second against that you have 170 to 200 odd crores you'll build up you'll take a loan of 200 odd crores do you need to dilute if if that is something that is 56:10 56 minutes, 10 seconds there in everybody's mind see dilution will only come if we have something more than this this is funded for if we take 56:17 56 minutes, 17 seconds a 200 cr debt against an asset of 550 crores that does not hold much issues along with that now let's make a small 56:26 56 minutes, 26 seconds uh you know uh let's let's just simulate something which is very exciting to me and I can talk about this people talk often about I kind of read reports and 56:35 56 minutes, 35 seconds they say that you know the ROC in the roe as well as the CG is lesser compared to other companies in cosmic CRF and that's only because you're in the cape 56:43 56 minutes, 43 seconds cycle you are growing faster than any of your peers and any of the market players who have been with you yeah there might be other players who growing much faster than you I don't have a clue of all of 56:52 56 minutes, 52 seconds But most of my peers when we talk about that think about it this way 12,000 to 1 lakh 40,000 metric tons 40 crores of 57:01 57 minutes, 1 second asset to 550 crores of asset total balance sheet value of 64 crores to 820 57:08 57 minutes, 8 seconds crores of balance sheet value which is which is kind of a huge jump in in in it's a humongous jump but along with that your debt remains on term loan only 57:16 57 minutes, 16 seconds for 36 crores. Now if you take 200 crores today and you add up all the money that you bought got from the pref 57:24 57 minutes, 24 seconds your acrals uh the money that you got from the uh the IPO as well as the debt 57:31 57 minutes, 31 seconds put together away from the working capital because working capital is funded you're ped in 2029 as per my understanding against a debt of that 57:40 57 minutes, 40 seconds nature add another 200 250 crores and add all the money that we've raised till now and add another 200 crores of race that probably we will do in the next 2 57:48 57 minutes, 48 seconds years like I said in 2027 28 FI28 think about it this way the totality you will 57:54 57 minutes, 54 seconds be standing at 30 to 30 35% uh ROC and this math I'm giving you as a forward book now if you kind of back 58:03 58 minutes, 3 seconds calculate you will be able to understand what the the numbers that I'm trying to say so let the economies of scale flow out let the entire value of the engine 58:11 58 minutes, 11 seconds of the growth engine pop out and I'm telling you we will all see something miraculous Thank you sir. 58:20 58 minutes, 20 seconds You had another question. Sorry. You had another question. You had another question. 58:23 58 minutes, 23 seconds Timeline timeline of uh processing and start of the production. 58:28 58 minutes, 28 seconds what what our team has planned is that uh hopefully by God's grace the moment we get so I'm not putting in a date but let's say next week say let's say by 58:37 58 minutes, 37 seconds June we finish our LOI and everything uh then July August September is something that we will be working out internally 58:45 58 minutes, 45 seconds for all the TVs for all the bank fundings for the all the clearances that we need to get from the statutory bodies and XYZ for the complete takeover and by 58:53 58 minutes, 53 seconds that time we'll also get the people who have to have the get the repairs and the EMC's in days for all the machines that have been stopped working or not been functioning over the last two to three 59:01 59 minutes, 1 second years and the repairs and maintenance costs and everything everything will be worked out in the next 90 days from the date of the LOI uh the moment we it's done uh from there so let's say June 59:10 59 minutes, 10 seconds July August September hopefully Hanji if everything completes by September October we can do everything we can start our first 59:19 59 minutes, 19 seconds commercial production by by April May by March April May anywhere between that depends on what and our and our 59:25 59 minutes, 25 seconds efficiencies But not not more than a year from where we stand today. 59:31 59 minutes, 31 seconds That that that's great. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Thank you. 59:38 59 minutes, 38 seconds Yeah, that's the next question from Sharan. Please go ahead. 59:46 59 minutes, 46 seconds No sir, I have one question. Yes. 59:51 59 minutes, 51 seconds So sir you said that you just now answered you the half of my question that probably it will take one year time next March April in order to get some 59:59 59 minutes, 59 seconds kind of topline bottom line from the MGEN so do you think that do you think that this LOI from COC and all these process will take so much of time about 1:00:08 1 hour, 8 seconds one year time no so basically I'll tell you what Naranji the process does not take that much time your factory is pretty much 1:00:16 1 hour, 16 seconds installed the repair maintenance will take a mere 60 to 90 days at its best ability. Why? 1:00:22 1 hour, 22 seconds There's a reason. So there are two flow reason also the the benefit of of having Amzen is most of your items are uh 1:00:32 1 hour, 32 seconds basically American made out of like American companies made or makes of Germans. So these ones once AMC 1:00:39 1 hour, 39 seconds contracts are freezed they will hardly take time. They will not beat around the bush. They will send their team and they'll finish it. So that is 60 to 90 1:00:46 1 hour, 46 seconds days in that in totality. And the bad part is that there are so many machines and there's a there's a the humongous 1:00:53 1 hour, 53 seconds asset that we need to rebuild. So I'm keeping 2 months to 3 months in hand go. 1:00:57 1 hour, 57 seconds So we should complete this by December, January if everything is handed over to me by June. However, if the delay in 1:01:04 1 hour, 1 minute, 4 seconds handing over any sort of procedural delay, you know it's India. Procedural delay cannot be controlled. Last year I should have taken Amson out but that's 1:01:12 1 hour, 1 minute, 12 seconds how it is. But I'm happy God's been kind. We we got AMS finally. 1:01:17 1 hour, 1 minute, 17 seconds So the idea is I think we should keep one year but if uh very positively we think and God's with us and everything is graceful then probably 9 months. 1:01:27 1 hour, 1 minute, 27 seconds Sure. Sure. Yes sir. Sir sir one more question. Uh so looks like the top line and the bottom line will not come from 1:01:35 1 hour, 1 minute, 35 seconds Amazon this year right 27. So without that imagine what can be the top line 1:01:41 1 hour, 1 minute, 41 seconds and bottom line for AI27 any any number in terms of percentage even will work. 1:01:49 1 hour, 1 minute, 49 seconds See I will not be able to give you an exact number and I would not want to give you a number because that's just unnecessary guidance but I'll tell you 1:01:56 1 hour, 1 minute, 56 seconds what we've guided in this if you go through the deck we've guided the quantity that will grow. If the prices grow, the top line will also grow 1:02:03 1 hour, 2 minutes, 3 seconds because you're not in the highest cycle of the of the of the of the pricing. 1:02:07 1 hour, 2 minutes, 7 seconds We've seen higher prices. So the prices grow of raw materials, the finished prices will also grow. And that will give you a good number. From where you 1:02:14 1 hour, 2 minutes, 14 seconds stand today, you are at least looking at 30% higher side. Keeping in mind that the global scenario that the investments 1:02:22 1 hour, 2 minutes, 22 seconds made by the government in infra and railway remains buoyant and is not on the lower cycle of their investments. It 1:02:30 1 hour, 2 minutes, 30 seconds is not like they will say that okay we'll invest two and a half lakh crores and they'll only invest 1 lakh cr the ex checker takes back 1 and a half lakh crores to fulfill some other issue that 1:02:40 1 hour, 2 minutes, 40 seconds is when a promoters like us who are in the lowest point of the cycle fix ourselves out in a particular position 1:02:47 1 hour, 2 minutes, 47 seconds where we cannot control that outcome but if everything goes smoothly we should achieve a number at least 20 25% higher 1:02:55 1 hour, 2 minutes, 55 seconds than where we are today but that is when the inflection point is so because that is where all your assets old assets are 1:03:03 1 hour, 3 minutes, 3 seconds fully utilized. Okay. So that is like a total cap out of uh a top out of NS 1:03:10 1 hour, 3 minutes, 10 seconds engineering uh and cosmic CRF. Uh Cosmic Springs and Engineers will still have 15 20 30% or more to give you. Uh but from there starts the story of the Amazon. 1:03:22 1 hour, 3 minutes, 22 seconds 2029 is what you should look at. FI 2029 you should look at a total of 350,000 1:03:30 1 hour, 3 minutes, 30 seconds metric tons in totality and if I'm right by my judgment at that point in time 100,000 rupees at an average pricing 1:03:37 1 hour, 3 minutes, 37 seconds will give you something like 3,500 crores which is something that we should all look at sir sir thank you so much good luck to 1:03:45 1 hour, 3 minutes, 45 seconds you thank you thanks you we'll take the next question from Krishna yoga please go ahead 1:03:57 1 hour, 3 minutes, 57 seconds Krishna, we'll move on to Akshhat. Please go ahead. 1:04:07 1 hour, 4 minutes, 7 seconds Yes. Am I audible? Yes, Ash. 1:04:10 1 hour, 4 minutes, 10 seconds Are you audible? Uh, hello sir. I wanted to ask the consideration that we were going to pay to consolidate NPL into 100%. 1:04:20 1 hour, 4 minutes, 20 seconds So Aar that is a question that will have to be decided by all the share stakeholders also and the entire board at large. It is something that we want to do from the management's perspective. 1:04:29 1 hour, 4 minutes, 29 seconds Uh but that will be decided by us through the SE room and we will have to apply to the SEB for an approval of that. Along with that there'll be a 1:04:37 1 hour, 4 minutes, 37 seconds there'll be a detailed report that will be given to us by the merchant banker. 1:04:40 1 hour, 4 minutes, 40 seconds uh any merchant banker that we freeze will have to go through the route which is specific to them. Uh I can assure you Akad that the idea of bringing this in 1:04:48 1 hour, 4 minutes, 48 seconds is only for consolidation and not for any other purpose. The idea is tomorrow if you if cosmic CRF ever wants to get 1:04:55 1 hour, 4 minutes, 55 seconds value system out of NS it is his baby right so that is when the other people who are outside and who are holding 1:05:02 1 hour, 5 minutes, 2 seconds minute stakehold stakeholders of NS might create some sort of incumbrance that's one point point two the value 1:05:09 1 hour, 5 minutes, 9 seconds proposition will be actually decided by the stakeholders through an EGM process most probably we'll have to run it through the compliance this is something 1:05:16 1 hour, 5 minutes, 16 seconds that has been in my head for quite some time we find value in it for consolidation your numbers will also grow with that. Along with that, the most important point is that the value 1:05:25 1 hour, 5 minutes, 25 seconds that we'll have to derive will be through the merchant banker through the SB route and through the procedure that is followed for such kind of transactions. 1:05:33 1 hour, 5 minutes, 33 seconds Okay. 1:05:34 1 hour, 5 minutes, 34 seconds And I wanted to ask on 1st July 2026 will be eligible for main board. So when are you applying for main board? 1:05:41 1 hour, 5 minutes, 41 seconds A soon as possible. So we are apply we are applicable we are actually eligible on the 30th June 2026. rightly said. Uh 1:05:48 1 hour, 5 minutes, 48 seconds we will be applying on the first week of July hopefully. Um I I have my merchant bankers in place. We've been kning up their heads the moment uh we were 1:05:57 1 hour, 5 minutes, 57 seconds actually in a position to understand that we fulfilled the eligibility. 1:06:00 1 hour, 6 minutes There's a small eligibility gap that we still have which we are talking uh to our merchant bankers with this will also be fulfilled in the next one month. So 1:06:08 1 hour, 6 minutes, 8 seconds by the end by June by by July by June end we'll be ready I think and by July we will be in a position to uh bring 1:06:15 1 hour, 6 minutes, 15 seconds this up and file for the uh transition to the main board with SE for both uh BSE and NSE. 1:06:22 1 hour, 6 minutes, 22 seconds Okay. So so at our peak will be will we be holding around 400 crores of debt at our peak? What will be our peak debt in our uh books? 1:06:32 1 hour, 6 minutes, 32 seconds U so when you talk about peak debt are you only talking about the term loans or the working capital? No, no. Uh everything after Amazon after everything 1:06:40 1 hour, 6 minutes, 40 seconds after Amazon at point if you do not take the liquid metal in consideration as of now uh your entire book debt will come to uh 1:06:50 1 hour, 6 minutes, 50 seconds so it'll be part so this year you will have only term loans for uh for Amazon 1:06:57 1 hour, 6 minutes, 57 seconds right and uh that's about it and a small term loan will come in for forging uh together they might sound at around 200 1:07:04 1 hour, 7 minutes, 4 seconds 250 odd across are the term debt with a motor moratorium for almost 9 months to 10 months or maybe a year and a payout period for 10 years so that you do not 1:07:13 1 hour, 7 minutes, 13 seconds have to stretch yourselves for making payments of the of the uh of the uh what's it called your interest because that will be more in in in in a V-shaped 1:07:21 1 hour, 7 minutes, 21 seconds rather than a slate straight line method that's what we're trying to structure so that the you know we understand that the moment your operation starts the debt 1:07:28 1 hour, 7 minutes, 28 seconds will not be con constituted at all but there's a nice silver lining around this ax with Amzen we only been talking about Chandigan plant right there are more 1:07:37 1 hour, 7 minutes, 37 seconds assets that Amazon carries which has value. So we will be able to set that out also against the debt. So that is something that we are trying to 1:07:45 1 hour, 7 minutes, 45 seconds structure so that there's not a lot of debt on the books at any point in time. 1:07:49 1 hour, 7 minutes, 49 seconds those uh the second point is when you talk about when we reach 2020 say 8 and your Amzen is full-blown you are go 1:07:58 1 hour, 7 minutes, 58 seconds you've gone into operations in forging in uh springs also NS full flow 85,000 metric tons 55,000 metric 6,000 metric 1:08:07 1 hour, 8 minutes, 7 seconds tons of uh capacities being fulfilled in uh in cosmic CRF all four put together and you are probably looking at uh the 1:08:15 1 hour, 8 minutes, 15 seconds casting unit at large or or any of the liquid metal units at charge that point in time your term loan should not be more than uh 300 because you must have 1:08:25 1 hour, 8 minutes, 25 seconds repaid some in the next 1 and a half two years. So 300 of term loan and uh 1:08:31 1 hour, 8 minutes, 31 seconds roughly 300 of working capital but then again having said that you will be making a good amount of money you'll be 1:08:39 1 hour, 8 minutes, 39 seconds making almost 10% of the top line that I just mentioned in 529 and that will be good enough for you to mitigate all of the needs that you need. 1:08:48 1 hour, 8 minutes, 48 seconds Awesome. Thank you so much. Congratulations. 1:08:52 1 hour, 8 minutes, 52 seconds Thank you. We'll take the question now from Krishna Yoga. Please go ahead. Yeah. 1:09:00 1 hour, 9 minutes Yes. Krishna. Yes. Yes. Hello. You're not audible. Krishna. 1:09:11 1 hour, 9 minutes, 11 seconds I think there's some issue there. We'll move on to Kalyan K. Please go ahead. 1:09:20 1 hour, 9 minutes, 20 seconds Sir I audible. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Please tell. Good evening sir. 1:09:27 1 hour, 9 minutes, 27 seconds First of all very congratulations for getting MJ today. I'm able to see that happiness of our shaved all in your face 1:09:35 1 hour, 9 minutes, 35 seconds sir. [laughter] Congratulations to you sir. 1:09:40 1 hour, 9 minutes, 40 seconds Yes. Yes sir. Yes sir. So I have couple of questions sir. First point uh I'm not 1:09:48 1 hour, 9 minutes, 48 seconds talking about cosmic because 1:09:55 1 hour, 9 minutes, 55 seconds sir your voice is breaking kalan your voice is not clear one minute 1:10:05 1 hour, 10 minutes, 5 seconds one minute sir actually so you are having with a very aggressive cap and expansion 1:10:14 1 hour, 10 minutes, 14 seconds underway uh which business verticals do you you believe that it can become the biggest growth drive for cosmic over next 3 to 5 1:10:23 1 hour, 10 minutes, 23 seconds years sir uh so your question if let me just reframe the question for you and you let me know if it's right or wrong if my understanding is right or wrong you are 1:10:32 1 hour, 10 minutes, 32 seconds asking me with cosmic CRF and it subsidiaries so CRF business NS cosmic springs uh forgings as well as your uh 1:10:40 1 hour, 10 minutes, 40 seconds Amzen with all the products so these four which will be the biggest that's what you're asking yes sir yes exactly which business by 1:10:48 1 hour, 10 minutes, 48 seconds farm by far so Amazon practically kalyanji is 1:10:56 1 hour, 10 minutes, 56 seconds practically say you finish off manufacturing everything like you set up everything your cosmic CRF your NS your 1:11:03 1 hour, 11 minutes, 3 seconds forging and your springs put together in in 90% capacity in total go Amazon is 1:11:11 1 hour, 11 minutes, 11 seconds equivalent to that single Wow. Okay. Okay. That's great, sir. That's great, sir. 1:11:16 1 hour, 11 minutes, 16 seconds So, that is why I've been running for one half two years. Otherwise, bad dog did not bite me to fight against people in the Supreme Court and Ancat. 1:11:24 1 hour, 11 minutes, 24 seconds Yes, sir. Yes, sir. 1:11:25 1 hour, 11 minutes, 25 seconds I've had sleepless nights about you, Samson. 1:11:28 1 hour, 11 minutes, 28 seconds Yes, sir. We are seeing that happiness in our face. No doubt. Sure, sir. Sure. 1:11:32 1 hour, 11 minutes, 32 seconds Second thing sir, recently yesterday I read an article in the newspaper that the government is planning to procure one lakh wagons which is having a t value of around 40,000 crores. 1:11:43 1 hour, 11 minutes, 43 seconds Yes. Yes sir, you're right. So basically sir this is a part of the this is this this thing sir if you remember if you go through the con that we did in half 1:11:50 1 hour, 11 minutes, 50 seconds yearly also the last year also I've been shouting about this and a lot of other wagon builders have also been speaking about this. If there's a rail wheel plans that the rail wheel rail plans 1:11:59 1 hour, 11 minutes, 59 seconds there's a rail plan of India of 2031 which might go up to 2032 33 keeping in mind the the global scenarios that we 1:12:07 1 hour, 12 minutes, 7 seconds have to having to go around with but the rail plan says that you need 8 and a half lakh wagons on tracks of uh DFCC 1:12:16 1 hour, 12 minutes, 16 seconds and of IR means Indian railways. So then the total 8 and a half lakh wagons today you sit with almost four four and a half lakh wagons at best. So you have four 1:12:24 1 hour, 12 minutes, 24 seconds lakh wagons to manufacture in the next 5 years which is approximately 80,000 wagons which is not possible our entire capacity on on ground today per 1:12:32 1 hour, 12 minutes, 32 seconds permissible capacity and probably operational and executable capacity among all wagon builders other than keeping Amazon aside every wagon build 1:12:41 1 hour, 12 minutes, 41 seconds put together is not more than 40,000 wagons per per uh year. So when you talk about that because what happens is some 1:12:49 1 hour, 12 minutes, 49 seconds wagon builder can come and say no no Aditya is wrong we can manufacture 500 wagons someone will say we can manufacture 800 wagons but the reality is with availability of raw materials 1:12:58 1 hour, 12 minutes, 58 seconds because they are having to buy raw materials wheel sets then you are having to have those consumables those inspection orientations a lot of things 1:13:05 1 hour, 13 minutes, 5 seconds are attached to that. So 40,000 wagons to 45,000 wagons at best. So we are not be we will never be able to achieve that 2031 plan. So if the railway at large, 1:13:14 1 hour, 13 minutes, 14 seconds the railway ministry, the railway board at large takes out 40,000 wagons at an average every year, that is a very good plan and I don't think it's for three 1:13:22 1 hour, 13 minutes, 22 seconds years. I think you can might you might have a slump for this year. uh maybe because of the reason being with the global scenarios and with the with the 1:13:31 1 hour, 13 minutes, 31 seconds with the you know the balance of payment issues with the government and all of that jazz that we have all known about because of the Middle Eastern war uh we 1:13:38 1 hour, 13 minutes, 38 seconds we might get stretched this year but next year onwards uh it will not be an issue at all you will have to have s 40,000 wagons being pulled out for the 1:13:47 1 hour, 13 minutes, 47 seconds next seven years and that is one of the main reasons why we built our ideology on on Amzen so strongly otherwise why would we think about building wagons at 1:13:55 1 hour, 13 minutes, 55 seconds large excellent Sir, excellent. Thank you. 1:13:57 1 hour, 13 minutes, 57 seconds Thank you for answering it. And also one one more question, sir. Regarding the regarding the container manufacturing, right sir. 1:14:06 1 hour, 14 minutes, 6 seconds So government has initiated some incentive program for uh container manufacturers to curb the imports from China. 1:14:14 1 hour, 14 minutes, 14 seconds So very few players are there. Uh can you share I think uh you are working on it. Can you share some light on this? 1:14:21 1 hour, 14 minutes, 21 seconds So the point is the container wagon the container uh manufacturing is of two types. the seaf as well as the land containers and also now there are a lot 1:14:28 1 hour, 14 minutes, 28 seconds of smaller containers made by various parties and people for various specific uses. We want to go for the seaf containers of 20 ft and and and 40 ft 1:14:38 1 hour, 14 minutes, 38 seconds containers. The reason is very simple s because of the equipment that I have available the machinery that I have in Amazon and the space that I have the 1:14:46 1 hour, 14 minutes, 46 seconds knowhow that I have that will allow me to make those wagons there. uh wagons as in there or containers there. I do not have space to manufacture containers with my 14 acres among my four units. 1:14:56 1 hour, 14 minutes, 56 seconds Those are those are all done. They do not have the bandwidth or the space to actually manufacture because that's a very voluminous job. But if you do it in 1:15:04 1 hour, 15 minutes, 4 seconds the west that's an area where there's a demand also for it. At the same time what happens is with fabrication you will see always people will talk about 1:15:13 1 hour, 15 minutes, 13 seconds fabrication strength coming into the east of India and executable strength of business coming into the west of India money lies in the west working is 1:15:22 1 hour, 15 minutes, 22 seconds happening in the east. So sir that is why we thought east we will work in the east and we will shift to the west to sell these items also and with Amazon 1:15:29 1 hour, 15 minutes, 29 seconds we'll have the strength of manufacturing those 10,000 is a number that we have spelled out of by just doing a mathematical calculation on it but the 1:15:37 1 hour, 15 minutes, 37 seconds day we step into the factory and we do work for almost 6 to 8 months I can assure you with my gut feeling on it we 10,000 is nothing in that asset nothing 1:15:46 1 hour, 15 minutes, 46 seconds sir okay final sir final question uh last question may I request you to reject join the queue please. 1:15:54 1 hour, 15 minutes, 54 seconds Sure sir. Sure sir. Yeah. Thank you. 1:15:56 1 hour, 15 minutes, 56 seconds Uh yeah since uh there is a time limit we'll take the last question from Sai Kumar. Please go ahead. 1:16:05 1 hour, 16 minutes, 5 seconds Yeah. Hi sir. Uh am I audible sir? Yes sir. Yes. Yes. Yes. 1:16:09 1 hour, 16 minutes, 9 seconds Yeah. Thank you for taking my question and I congratulate on a great set of numbers and on the Am side. Um yeah 1:16:17 1 hour, 16 minutes, 17 seconds actually you have guided in the previous calls you guided like 100% growth in excluding Amgen for the next 1.5 to two 1:16:25 1 hour, 16 minutes, 25 seconds years. So are youing on to that this year are we going to grow 100% this year? 1:16:33 1 hour, 16 minutes, 33 seconds So the point is when we talk about 100% growth the amount of the the basically the raw material pricing is always 1:16:40 1 hour, 16 minutes, 40 seconds fluctuating on its own. If you remember in the first year I was naive enough to believe that 100% growth happens because my raw metal prices will remain the 1:16:47 1 hour, 16 minutes, 47 seconds same. But whatever happens happens for a good reason. We were hit hard by our investors and told that this is not how you should present yourself. And I 1:16:56 1 hour, 16 minutes, 56 seconds learned it. So I I have understood that it is the volume that I can control sir in my factory under my four four walls is all that I can control. the volume. I 1:17:04 1 hour, 17 minutes, 4 seconds can control the the cost and I can control the income and the outflow but I cannot control the market at large. So 1:17:11 1 hour, 17 minutes, 11 seconds tomorrow if railway decides to actually bring in 45 50,000 wagons at one go and does a business then believe me you're 1:17:19 1 hour, 17 minutes, 19 seconds not talking 100% is very less because you have the capacity to increase very fast and we've shown that we've shown 1:17:26 1 hour, 17 minutes, 26 seconds that we can grow at 12x in in two and a half years. So believe me what stops me from growing to 20x in three and a half 1:17:33 1 hour, 17 minutes, 33 seconds years but my only constraint is the global scenario. I am in no control of the global outcome the government of 1:17:40 1 hour, 17 minutes, 40 seconds India's decisions as well as the policym so we are at the at the mercy of these things having said that we do want to 1:17:48 1 hour, 17 minutes, 48 seconds grow at the rate that we are growing which is no less than 100% as far as the promoter's eyes are but obviously the promoter's eyes are always bent towards 1:17:56 1 hour, 17 minutes, 56 seconds the good that he does and not the bad that he does. So sorry for for not understanding my motion but obviously trying to understand the fact that we 1:18:03 1 hour, 18 minutes, 3 seconds are putting in our best to grow at the fastest scale that we are. 1:18:08 1 hour, 18 minutes, 8 seconds Okay. Yeah sir. And I mean I I mean I have a follow up on that as well. You said that commodity prices fluctuation 1:18:15 1 hour, 18 minutes, 15 seconds and all. So how do you mitigate that and what's the margin you have in your mind uh based on this raw metal fluctuations 1:18:22 1 hour, 18 minutes, 22 seconds keep on fluctuating right? So you need to build up some inventory and all. So what kind of margins you want to going forward uh in this year what kind of 1:18:31 1 hour, 18 minutes, 31 seconds margin you you have in your mind so I'll tell you what side uh the thing is that when we to talk about trade 1:18:39 1 hour, 18 minutes, 39 seconds receivables and payables the I carry a huge amount of stock right now why do I carry a huge amount of stock I can do it with 50% stock also that is to protect 1:18:47 1 hour, 18 minutes, 47 seconds the price one month of delay on de dispatch can only hit me for 0.5 to 6% on the cost but it will not hit me for 1:18:54 1 hour, 18 minutes, 54 seconds the variation of 1 and a half to 2% % of the raw minute pricing at times 5%. 1:18:59 1 hour, 18 minutes, 59 seconds Point one. Point two, I I'm a believer that I'm not in the business of of of arbitrage. I'm not in the business of 1:19:06 1 hour, 19 minutes, 6 seconds arbitrage. I do not want to buy at the high at the low end and then sell at the high and all that nonsense. I am a industrious in the format of engineering 1:19:14 1 hour, 19 minutes, 14 seconds products, manufacturing engineering products. So, what we want to only do is we want to have long-term contracts. 1:19:19 1 hour, 19 minutes, 19 seconds Secondly, with railway contracts, we always have a PVC that protects us to a certain extent which is price variation clause. We've tried to build that up 1:19:27 1 hour, 19 minutes, 27 seconds with our EPC contractors also. Now, when you have an EPC contractor like for example a Shapo Gi Pal, you might not have because you are very small for 1:19:35 1 hour, 19 minutes, 35 seconds them. So, what happens is you they tell you you want to do 100 cr take it. But if there is a problem in the site, he 1:19:42 1 hour, 19 minutes, 42 seconds might delay delay you to not execute or probably the payment might go here or maybe that that the disarray will stop you from buying raw material. At some 1:19:50 1 hour, 19 minutes, 50 seconds point the raw material fluctuation will hit you. That is why we work with traders. Why traders? Because smaller quantity of purchases, smaller quantity 1:19:57 1 hour, 19 minutes, 57 seconds of sales allows us to protect ourselves from the arbitrage. But having said this when we will be buying three lakh 50,000 1:20:04 1 hour, 20 minutes, 4 seconds metric tons we will be actually hedging ourselves against the costs that we are having to bridge out the hedge cost will 1:20:12 1 hour, 20 minutes, 12 seconds be a part of my overall cost which is not much in numbers compared to the variations of because once you're doing 1:20:19 1 hour, 20 minutes, 19 seconds 40 50,000 tons in in railways no it's no big deal. So what happens is you can protect yourself with the PVC to the certain extent but when you're talking 1:20:27 1 hour, 20 minutes, 27 seconds about three 50,000 tons four lakh tons you will not be able to protect yourself nobody will be able to give you a cover for that. So for that we were talking about liquid metal which is a very very 1:20:35 1 hour, 20 minutes, 35 seconds uh diversified way of uh you know protecting yourself against um against uh the fluctuations of the raw material 1:20:42 1 hour, 20 minutes, 42 seconds prices. Along with that you have to understand that there's an arbitrage cost around it. Hedge it and go ahead with it. We'll do that once we touch two laps. 1:20:52 1 hour, 20 minutes, 52 seconds Thank you sir. Uh we'll take the last question from Shrea Roya. Please go ahead. 1:21:00 1 hour, 21 minutes Yes. Yeah. Congratulations. 1:21:04 1 hour, 21 minutes, 4 seconds Very amazing set. Uh my question to you is that how much of revenue are we expecting from both our existing 1:21:11 1 hour, 21 minutes, 11 seconds capacity as well as new capacity at group level in for this FI27? 1:21:18 1 hour, 21 minutes, 18 seconds So sh the point is this year our average pricing has been somewhere around 70 to 751 in terms of raw metal pricing right 1:21:25 1 hour, 21 minutes, 25 seconds so raw metal pricing has shifted from uh last year it was approximately 52 53,000 it has shifted to around 60,000 we have 1:21:32 1 hour, 21 minutes, 32 seconds a 10 rupee margin that counts out this year we are seeing an uprise in the pricing that's happening okay so because there's a there is a lot of demand that 1:21:41 1 hour, 21 minutes, 41 seconds was pent up that will open up at some point or the other maybe it opens up in June in July in August and that is a market understanding that we've had. So 1:21:49 1 hour, 21 minutes, 49 seconds in the second half, not the first half but the second half the prices will shoot up to the best of my understanding. The prices will shoot up by more than 7 to 10%. So you can look 1:21:56 1 hour, 21 minutes, 56 seconds at this same quantity at 10% higher. So that does not mean that the raw material pricing 10% higher will will fetch you 1:22:04 1 hour, 22 minutes, 4 seconds the because the old contracts of 760 crores is at the same price which we'll have to you know get ourselves a best with. Also, we'll have to secure 1:22:12 1 hour, 22 minutes, 12 seconds ourselves with long-term contracts and also we'll have to set out those ones with arbitrageing at hedging costs or probably buying those raw materials and 1:22:20 1 hour, 22 minutes, 20 seconds keeping it with us. But having said that, if I have to answer your question in a very in a very straightforward method, Shia, my point will be that 1:22:28 1 hour, 22 minutes, 28 seconds today you are sitting at 1 lakh 33,600 metric tons of optimum capac installed capacity. you have achieved 1 lakh 6,000 1:22:36 1 hour, 22 minutes, 36 seconds to 7,000 metric tons 1 lakh 7,000 metric tons of capacity next year in FI27 1:22:43 1 hour, 22 minutes, 43 seconds you will have roughly 1 lakh 22,000 to 1 lakh 30,000 metric tons of capacity that 1:22:49 1 hour, 22 minutes, 49 seconds you will outflow but again like Mr. Sai had asked me let's have our fingers crossed that this war stops Mr. Trump 1:22:58 1 hour, 22 minutes, 58 seconds allows India to breathe and we have enough orders flowing in and the payments from the excheer starts coming in otherwise there's always a stretch in 1:23:07 1 hour, 23 minutes, 7 seconds your trade payables and and and and receivables and that is where you get into the debt traps and I'm in no mood to get into trade traps but yes Shia 1:23:15 1 hour, 23 minutes, 15 seconds because you're in this conversation with me I will end this in a particular point this company is only three and a half years old and I have always told all my 1:23:23 1 hour, 23 minutes, 23 seconds stakeholders stick around believe in this company for the next 3 years by FI20 29 you will see that this will have a 1:23:31 1 hour, 23 minutes, 31 seconds complete synthesis of economies of scale. You will leave aside those small inhibitions that are happening in the global market because you're more of a 1:23:39 1 hour, 23 minutes, 39 seconds local market player. You're a you're you're an indigenous player. Your products that you're manufacturing are more requirement are more required in 1:23:46 1 hour, 23 minutes, 46 seconds the indigenous market. You are in the industries like railways and in infrastructure which is bound to grow without which India can't grow. And 1:23:54 1 hour, 23 minutes, 54 seconds because of all this, because of the India growth story, you will by anyhow want to and by God's grace having your 1:24:01 1 hour, 24 minutes, 1 second fingers crossed will achieve 350,000 metric tons. That is the vision today. 1:24:05 1 hour, 24 minutes, 5 seconds Once you achieve that, your numbers will be will be will be humongous compared to what we are today. 1:24:12 1 hour, 24 minutes, 12 seconds Thank you Adita sir and thank you to all the participants for joining on this call. This brings us to the end of this conference call. Thank you. 1:24:20 1 hour, 24 minutes, 20 seconds Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. 1:24:22 1 hour, 24 minutes, 22 seconds Thank you sir. Thank you. Have a good evening. Thank you. 1:24:24 1 hour, 24 minutes, 24 seconds Thank