Carborundum Universal Limited — Q3 FY26

Carborundum Universal Ltd Q3 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_XgYKVlRCk Published: 3 months ago

0:00 Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Carburendum Universal Q3 FY26 earnings conference call hosted by DAM 0:09 9 seconds Capital Advisors Limited. As a reminder, all participants line will be in listenonly mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions 0:18 18 seconds after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on 0:26 26 seconds your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Kunal 0:33 33 seconds Sha from DAM Capital Advisors. Thank you and over to you sir. 0:39 39 seconds Yeah, welcome to the 3QS26 earnings conc call of K Random Universal Limited. From the management side today we have Mr. 0:46 46 seconds Shraran Arjin the managing director and Mr. G Chandra Mali the adviser. At this point, I'd like to hand over the call to 0:54 54 seconds the management for their opening remarks post which we can take up the Q&A. Thanks and over to you, sir. 1:02 1 minute, 2 seconds Good morning. I am Chandra Modi. Let us start the proceeding with the disclaimer class. During the uh call, we may make 1:10 1 minute, 10 seconds certain statement which reflect our outlook for the future or which could be considered as forwardlooking statement. 1:15 1 minute, 15 seconds These statements are based on management current expectation and are associated with uncertaintities and risk are more fully detailed in our annual report 1:24 1 minute, 24 seconds which may cause the actual result to differ. Hence these statement must be reviewed in conjunction with the risk that the company faces. Thank you. 1:33 1 minute, 33 seconds Good morning to all of you and uh happy new year to all of you. A warm welcome to our third quarter earnings call for the financial year FI26. 1:48 1 minute, 48 seconds Uh thank you for joining us today. 1:51 1 minute, 51 seconds Um we'll begin this call by providing an overview and then uh followed up by Q&A. 2:01 2 minutes, 1 second on a standalone basis. Uh the standalone sales in Q3 FI26 was 769 crores compared 2:11 2 minutes, 11 seconds to 712 crores in Q2 FI26. This is a growth of 7.9%. 2:20 2 minutes, 20 seconds Ceramic grew by 11.9%. 2:24 2 minutes, 24 seconds from 228 crores in Q2 FI26 to 255 crores in Q3 FI26. 2:33 2 minutes, 33 seconds Electrominerals grew by 7.9% from 213 2:38 2 minutes, 38 seconds crores in Q2 FI26 to 229 crores in FI Q3 FI26. 2:47 2 minutes, 47 seconds Braces grew by 4.9% from 308 crores in Q2 FI26 to 323 crores in Q3 FI26. 2:58 2 minutes, 58 seconds Standalone sales in Q3 FI26 was 769 crores compared to 728 crores in Q3 FI25. 3:08 3 minutes, 8 seconds This is a growth of 5.6%. Abrasive grew by 9.8%. 3:13 3 minutes, 13 seconds Electrominerals grew by 8.9%. and ceramics dropped by 3.8%. 3:20 3 minutes, 20 seconds On a 9 months basis, standalone sales was 2,179 crores compared to 297 crores uh for the same period last year. 3:32 3 minutes, 32 seconds This is uh growth of 3.9%. 3:36 3 minutes, 36 seconds Electrominerals grew by 7.3%, ceramic grew by 1.7% and abrasive grew by 1.3%. 3:47 3 minutes, 47 seconds At the standalone level, PBAT of Q3 FI26 3:53 3 minutes, 53 seconds grew by 32% compared to 87 crores 4:00 4 minutes uh in Q2 FI26. The PB80 for Q3 FI26 was 115 crores compared to 110 crores in Q3 FI25. 4:12 4 minutes, 12 seconds This is a growth of 5.3%. 4:16 4 minutes, 16 seconds Standalone PVAT margin increase sequentially from 12.2% in Q2 to 15% in Q3. 4:27 4 minutes, 27 seconds This was uh compared to Q3 FI25 is uh is almost flat 4:34 4 minutes, 34 seconds at YTD 9 months level. Sandon PB80 was 369 crores compared to 344 crores. This is a growth of 7.1%. 4:45 4 minutes, 45 seconds CBT margin increased from 16.4% in FI25 to 16.9% in FI26. 4:56 4 minutes, 56 seconds Standard profit after tax for Q3 FI26 was 85 crores compared to 64 crores in Q2 FI26. 5:06 5 minutes, 6 seconds This is an increase of 31% on a sequential basis compared to 81 crores in Q3 FI25. This is an increase of 4.9%. 5:19 5 minutes, 19 seconds Profit margins in Q3 FI26 was 6% compared to 2.8% 8% in Q325 5:25 5 minutes, 25 seconds and 5.8% in Q2 FI26. 5:32 5 minutes, 32 seconds At the 9 months level, standalone profit after tax was 294 C compared to 260 course in the same period last year. 5:41 5 minutes, 41 seconds This marks an increase of 12.9% at the weight9 9 months level. Pat margin in 20 5:49 5 minutes, 49 seconds FI26 were 13.5% compared to 12.4% in the same period last year. 5:57 5 minutes, 57 seconds Moving to the consolidated results on a YTD 9 months basis, consolidated sales was 3,76 6:06 6 minutes, 6 seconds compared to 3,635 crores uh in the 9 months of FI25. 6:15 6 minutes, 15 seconds This marks a 3.6% growth. Ceramic grew by 6.1%. 6:22 6 minutes, 22 seconds Braid grew by 2.4% 4% and electro minerals was almost flat. 6:30 6 minutes, 30 seconds Consolidated sales in Q3 FI26 was,273 crores compared to,241 crores in Q3 FI25. 6:40 6 minutes, 40 seconds This marks a growth of 2.5%. Braces grew by 8.1%. 6:48 6 minutes, 48 seconds And uh ceramic was almost flat. Electro minerals dropped by 3.6%. 6:57 6 minutes, 57 seconds On a sequential basis, consolidated sales in Q3 FI26 was,273 cores compared to,287 coursees in Q2 FI26. 7:10 7 minutes, 10 seconds This marks a drop of 1.1%. Ceramic grew by 4.7%. 7:16 7 minutes, 16 seconds Electrominerals grew by 6%. Abrasive dropped by 2.5%. 7:23 7 minutes, 23 seconds Coming to the bottom line performance consolidated PBIT for Q3 FI26 was 109 cores compared to 141 cores in Q3 FI25. 7:36 7 minutes, 36 seconds consolidated uh PBAT uh in Q2 FI26 was 111 crores which is 7:44 7 minutes, 44 seconds almost flat compared to Q3 FI26 at the 9 months level consolidated PBA 7:52 7 minutes, 52 seconds was 301 crores compared to 444 crores in FI25 8:00 8 minutes consolidated profit after tax for Q3 FI26 was 76 crores compared to 35 crores in the same period last time. 8:11 8 minutes, 11 seconds The profit after tax of Q3 FI25 includes an exceptional item related to VAW at 8:19 8 minutes, 19 seconds the Q3 FI26 level. The PAT margin was 6% compared to 28 2.8% in Q3 FI25. 8:30 8 minutes, 30 seconds On the sequential basis, consolidated profit after tax for Q3 FI26 was 76 crores compared to 75 crores in Q226. 8:40 8 minutes, 40 seconds At the YTD 9 level, consolidated profit after tax was 212 crores 8:48 8 minutes, 48 seconds compared to 264 crores in the same period last year. 8:53 8 minutes, 53 seconds profit after tax of the for the first 9 months of FI25 includes exceptional item related to VAW at the ATD 9 months level 9:03 9 minutes, 3 seconds the PAT margins were 5.6% compared to 7.63% of 3% in the same period last year. 9:11 9 minutes, 11 seconds I'll move now to abbrases. Standalone abrasives. Standalone abrasive recorded a sales of 323 crores in Q3 FI26 9:20 9 minutes, 20 seconds compared to 294 crores in Q3 FI25. This is a growth of 9.8%. 9:29 9 minutes, 29 seconds The growth was broad-based driven by retail, industrial and precision. 9:34 9 minutes, 34 seconds on a sequential basis compared to the sales of 308 crores Q2 FI26 this is a growth of 4.9% 9:45 9 minutes, 45 seconds and uh on an OTD basis the FI26 917 crores is a total sales in FI26 which is 9:53 9 minutes, 53 seconds a growth of 1.3% compared to 95 crores in the same period last year 10:02 10 minutes, 2 seconds consolidated abraasives um Q3 FI26 consolidated sales was 569 10:09 10 minutes, 9 seconds course with a growth of 8.1% compared to 526 course in Q3 FI25. 10:16 10 minutes, 16 seconds This growth was contributed by standalone business which grew by 9.8%. 10:21 10 minutes, 21 seconds compared to Q2 FI26 consolidates were lower by 2.5% compared to moving from 10:28 10 minutes, 28 seconds 584 crores in Q2 FI26 to 569 course in Q3 FI26 standalone business grew by 4.9%. 10:40 10 minutes, 40 seconds Rudius abdases had a small drop which is in line with the seasonality consolidated sales for weighted in 9 10:49 10 minutes, 49 seconds months in FI26 was,660 crores with a growth of 2.4% when compared to,621 10:56 10 minutes, 56 seconds crores for the same period last year at the level stand abracious grew by 1.3%. 11:07 11 minutes, 7 seconds Now I will move to Rodius. 11:10 11 minutes, 10 seconds In Q3 FI26, RHDIS achieved a net sales of 14.8 million euro which is a 3.5% 11:17 11 minutes, 17 seconds drop over 15.3 million in Q3 FI25. On the 11:24 11 minutes, 24 seconds sequential basis, sales decline from 17.4 million to 14.8 million. 11:31 11 minutes, 31 seconds Normally Q3 is a lower quarter 2 and a half months quarter because of the Christmas vacations etc. 11:40 11 minutes, 40 seconds At the 9 months level FI26 RODS recorded sales of 45 million euro compared to 49 11:47 11 minutes, 47 seconds million euro. You might remember that we lost close to 5 million sales in um Q1 11:55 11 minutes, 55 seconds due to the shifting of warehouses in uh in Q1. 12:01 12 minutes, 1 second Q3 FI26 the loss after tax was84 million euro compared to the loss after tax of 0.78 12:09 12 minutes, 9 seconds million on a sequential basis loss after tax increased from 0.57 to84 million 12:18 12 minutes, 18 seconds at 9 months level FI26 incurred a loss of loss after tax of 3 million this is 12:26 12 minutes, 26 seconds after PPA rate of 2.1 million the loss of business judition shifting of warehouse in the um is the predominant reason for the higher losses. 12:37 12 minutes, 37 seconds The 9 month loss after tax in FI26 was89 million. 12:43 12 minutes, 43 seconds So on a fullear year basis uh we said in the last call that RDIS will do same 12:51 12 minutes, 51 seconds as last year in Q2, Q3 and Q4. So this means an annual sales of 62.6 6 million. 13:00 13 minutes We now expect the fullear sales to be about 60 million. We expect the fullear loss to be in the range of 4.5 million 13:07 13 minutes, 7 seconds euro after write off of PPA about 2.8 million. 13:15 13 minutes, 15 seconds AcoD 9 months level ao recorded a sales of 7.9 million euro compared to 7.6 million 13:24 13 minutes, 24 seconds euro in the same period last year. This represents a growth of 4.6% for the quarter. AUKO recorded sales of 2.4 13:33 13 minutes, 33 seconds million which is a 3% growth over sales of 2.3 million in Q3 FI25. 13:41 13 minutes, 41 seconds On a sequential basis, sales dropped by 19% from 2.9 million in Q2 FI26 to 2.4 million in Q3 FI26. 13:51 13 minutes, 51 seconds In Q3 FI26 recorded loss after loss before tax of Euro 7 2.7 million 13:58 13 minutes, 58 seconds compared to the loss before tax of euro 1.4 million in Q3 FI25 and the loss before tax of euro 1.5 14:07 14 minutes, 7 seconds million in Q2 FI26. The higher loss is primarily due to um no production during this period to 14:16 14 minutes, 16 seconds optimize the inventory and hence uh ability to recover the fixed cost was lower 14:24 14 minutes, 24 seconds precisely there was also a small one-time SP expenditure that they incurred 14:32 14 minutes, 32 seconds at the 9 at the YTD 9 months level. FI26 AUKO incurred a loss before tax of 5.1 14:39 14 minutes, 39 seconds million compared to the loss before tax of 3.7 million the same period last year. 14:47 14 minutes, 47 seconds Now I'll cover the bottom line performance of the abrasive segment. 14:51 14 minutes, 51 seconds Consolidate a PB80 was in Q3 FI26 was uh 20 crores with a drop of 28% compared to 15:00 15 minutes PVAT of 28 crores in Q3 FI25. This was an account of PVA drop 15:07 15 minutes, 7 seconds in a core on a sequential basis PV of consolid 15:14 15 minutes, 14 seconds declined from 33 course to 20. This drop uh is again mainly on account of uh AOCO 15:24 15 minutes, 24 seconds at the YTD 9 months level consolidated PB8 in FI26 was 65 crores 15:32 15 minutes, 32 seconds compared to PB8 of 118 crores for the same period last year. The drop is 15:38 15 minutes, 38 seconds contributed by Rodius, Aoko and the standalone electro minerals. 15:48 15 minutes, 48 seconds Standalone electro minerals. Standalone electro minerals recorded a sales of 229 crores in Q3 FI26 compared to 2011 crores in Q3 FI25. 16:00 16 minutes This marks a growth of uh 8.9%. 16:05 16 minutes, 5 seconds The growth was driven by export segment which is uh a very substantial progress that we have made on a sequential basis. 16:14 16 minutes, 14 seconds Sales of 29 crores in Q3 FI26 represents a growth of 7.9% compared to sales of 213 crores in Q2 FI26. 16:27 16 minutes, 27 seconds Sales for the YTD 9 months period was at 654 cores which is a growth of 7.3% compared to 69 crores. 16:39 16 minutes, 39 seconds Consolidated DMD sales for YTD 9 months FI26 was,204 coursees with a growth 16:46 16 minutes, 46 seconds of.5% and compared,19 course the same period last year. At the 16:53 16 minutes, 53 seconds OT level, standard electro minerals grew by 7.3%. Foscar grew by 16.6%. 17:01 17 minutes, 1 second VAW dropped by 25%. 17:04 17 minutes, 4 seconds Uh drop in VAW reflects due to the US sanctions which was imposed in January 2025. 17:14 17 minutes, 14 seconds Compared to Q2 FI26 sales was most flat moving from 399 crores to 401 crores. 17:23 17 minutes, 23 seconds Standalone business grew by 7.9%. 17:27 17 minutes, 27 seconds Um and I think uh there was a decline in FOSCAR as well as in EAW. 17:37 17 minutes, 37 seconds Q3 FI26 sales was at 401 crores with a drop of 3.6% 416 crores. 17:45 17 minutes, 45 seconds Standalone business grew by 8.9% and VAW dropped by 28% grew by 6.5%. 17:56 17 minutes, 56 seconds Now going to VAW at the 9D 9 months level VAW recorder sales of ruble 4.8 18:03 18 minutes, 3 seconds billion compared to rubil 7.6 billion in the same period last year. This represents a 36% drop over last year. 18:12 18 minutes, 12 seconds VAW came under the sanction since January 2025. 18:19 18 minutes, 19 seconds For the quarter, VW achieved a sales of 1.4 billion, which is uh drop of 46% 18:26 18 minutes, 26 seconds compared to the last year same period at 2.6 billion. 18:33 18 minutes, 33 seconds On the sequential basis, sales declined from 1.5 billion to 1.4 4 billion almost 18:40 18 minutes, 40 seconds flat. At the IT 9 months level, BAW recorded profit after tax of 44 million 18:49 18 minutes, 49 seconds 414 million compared to profit after tax of 35 million in the same period last year. 18:58 18 minutes, 58 seconds We move to the FCAR at the 9month level. 19:02 19 minutes, 2 seconds Pusca recorded a sales of rand 336 million compared to 308 million rand 19:11 19 minutes, 11 seconds in the same period last year. This represents a growth of 9% over the last year. Sales volume went up substantially 19:21 19 minutes, 21 seconds 28% growth. At the same time the realization fell by 13% because of the price pressure from Chinese competition. 19:31 19 minutes, 31 seconds In addition to this rand appreciated by 6%. Very strong appreciation uh because 19:37 19 minutes, 37 seconds of the rand appreciation coupled with uh you know the price drop 19:45 19 minutes, 45 seconds and the volume increase. The net result is a sales uh value increase of 9%. 19:54 19 minutes, 54 seconds In Q3 FI26, Fossar achieved a sales of Z 101 million which is a 4.5% decrease 20:03 20 minutes, 3 seconds over 106 million in Q3 FI25. Again volume mentalization dropped by 13%, volume went up by 22%. 20:14 20 minutes, 14 seconds Rand appreciated by 8%. And so that's the basic reason for the again impact 20:22 20 minutes, 22 seconds on a sequential basis sales declined from around 114 million in Q2526 to 101 million. 20:33 20 minutes, 33 seconds The volume remained flat and the sales drop is due to the rand appreciation in the same period. 20:42 20 minutes, 42 seconds At the 9 months level, FOSCA recorded loss after tax of 66 million compared last after tax 20:50 20 minutes, 50 seconds of 22 million in the same period last year. Q3 FI2 made a profit of tax of 10 20:57 20 minutes, 57 seconds million and Q3 FI26 became a loss after tax of 24 million. that the this drop is 21:04 21 minutes, 4 seconds in profit is predominantly due to the drop in price and appreciation of rand and the sequential basis of tax was almost flat. 21:16 21 minutes, 16 seconds Now I'll cover the bottom performance of the segment on the sequential basis PVA 21:23 21 minutes, 23 seconds of consolidated EMD increased from 33 crores to 34 crores in FI in Q3 FI26. 21:31 21 minutes, 31 seconds This is a 16% increase sequentially. 21:35 21 minutes, 35 seconds The solid electro minerals PBAT for Q3 FI26 was at 35 crores a drop of 48.7% 21:43 21 minutes, 43 seconds compared to 68 crores in Q3 FI2 21:49 21 minutes, 49 seconds mainly on account of PB drop in VAW and FOSCAR at the 9 months level consolidated 21:58 21 minutes, 58 seconds electro minerals P8 was 72 crores compared to 168 crores in the same period last here 22:06 22 minutes, 6 seconds uh at the 9 months level margins have declined from 14% 66% on a YTD basis. 22:15 22 minutes, 15 seconds I'll move to ceramics now. Consolidated ceramics sales for YTD 9 months in FI26 was 917 crores with a growth of 6.1%. 22:28 22 minutes, 28 seconds when compared to 864 crores in the same period last year. At the WG level, standalone salamis grew by 1.7%. 22:38 22 minutes, 38 seconds Compared to Q2, sales were higher by 4.7% moving from 301 crores to 316 crores. 22:46 22 minutes, 46 seconds In Q3 FI26 sales was 316 crores with a growth of4% compared to Q3 FI25 at 315 crores. 22:59 22 minutes, 59 seconds Standalone ceramics standalone ceramics recorded sales of 258 crores which is a growth of 11.9% compared to 228 crores in Q2 FI26. 23:13 23 minutes, 13 seconds In Q3 FI26 sale of 255 crores dropped by 3.8% compared to 265 crores in Q3 FI25. 23:24 23 minutes, 24 seconds At the IT level sales was 321 crores which is a growth of 1.7% compared to 310 crores in the same period last year. 23:35 23 minutes, 35 seconds Now total depth position there was no depth in our standalone books. The total consolidated depth 23:42 23 minutes, 42 seconds uh was about 290 crores compared to 210 coursees in the same 23:49 23 minutes, 49 seconds period last year and 108 course at the same period last year. 23:55 23 minutes, 55 seconds The depict ratio is 0.07 at the consolidated level. Cash in cash 24:03 24 minutes, 3 seconds in equipments at the consolidated uh level was uh consolidated level without VAW was 385 crores. 24:13 24 minutes, 13 seconds Capex during the first 9 months the capex investment was 248 crores compared to 209 crores same period last year. 24:24 24 minutes, 24 seconds He said we will spend 350 crores for the full year and we feel that uh we should be completing the two 350 crores of capex. 24:37 24 minutes, 37 seconds I'll come to the guidance. Um during the last call I said growth in consolid could be five and a half to 6.5%. 24:48 24 minutes, 48 seconds I maintain the same guidance consolidated ceramics we communicated a 24:54 24 minutes, 54 seconds sales growth of 16% to 18% at the in the beginning of the year we marginally bring this down from 13 to 14%. 25:05 25 minutes, 5 seconds abrasive sales in our last call we communicated 4 to 4% 5% for the year I 25:13 25 minutes, 13 seconds maintained the same consolidated DMD we gave a guidance of 1 to2% sales growth I maintain the same 25:23 25 minutes, 23 seconds margins in the ceramic segment we communicated PB80 margin of 23.5% to 23.7% 25:30 25 minutes, 30 seconds on a fullear basis uh we are likely to be 21 to 22%. 25:38 25 minutes, 38 seconds EMD in the last call we said 4 and a half to 5.5% this is the PB8 margin we maintain the same gadence 25:47 25 minutes, 47 seconds abrasive last time we said PBT margin could be 6% to 6 and 12% on a full year basis we now revise that to 4 to 4.5%. 26:01 26 minutes, 1 second We said the last time the overall consolidated PBAT margin could be 8.2 to 8.5%. 26:08 26 minutes, 8 seconds This could be 7% to 8%. 26:12 26 minutes, 12 seconds On the capex side we said we will spend 350 crores on a full year basis. We spent so far 248 crores at a on a 9mon 26:22 26 minutes, 22 seconds basis. We maintained a full year guidance of 350 crores of capex. 26:28 26 minutes, 28 seconds I now uh open up for your Q&A and then we will conclude the call. Thank you. 26:35 26 minutes, 35 seconds Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone 26:44 26 minutes, 44 seconds telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are 26:51 26 minutes, 51 seconds requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question Q assembles. 27:18 27 minutes, 18 seconds The first question is from the line of Amit Anwani from Prabhuas Slayadar Capital. Please go ahead. 27:27 27 minutes, 27 seconds Hi sir, thanks uh for the opportunity. 27:30 27 minutes, 30 seconds So first question for the reduced uh guidance in ceramics and we can see that uh even standalone businesses kind of 4% 27:40 27 minutes, 40 seconds down. So uh uh could you explain what what went wrong and uh within that uh is 27:47 27 minutes, 47 seconds that the exports uh from ceramics uh which has also been impacted and uh uh versus the technical and gear ceramics 27:55 27 minutes, 55 seconds how the uh situation in ceramics uh since we're expecting some recovery after uh uh uh Q and Q2 and uh we are 28:05 28 minutes, 5 seconds again revising down the guidance uh for 7 28:12 28 minutes, 12 seconds So I think um we are not again revising this is the first time I'm bringing it 28:18 28 minutes, 18 seconds down. We feel that I think uh ceramics uh Q4 will be a strong quarter first of all 28:27 28 minutes, 27 seconds because we feel that ceramic um on a full year basis the projects are getting delayed and 28:35 28 minutes, 35 seconds that is what is causing us this uh challenge of Q3 but I think if you look at sequentially they have done well on a 28:44 28 minutes, 44 seconds standalone basis and we feel that Q4 will be a very strong quarter based on the order backlog that what we have. 28:52 28 minutes, 52 seconds However, we expect that there could be delays in some of the projects like for example while we have an order 29:01 29 minutes, 1 second ability to ship depends on the inspection by the customers and there could be some delays. Hence, we are 29:10 29 minutes, 10 seconds cautiously bring this down. We felt that uh you know there could be some challenge hence we are bringing it down. 29:18 29 minutes, 18 seconds So that's what uh I would think. So it is not uh anything at this point in time we feel otherwise. 29:28 29 minutes, 28 seconds So what's the uh kind of exports uh contribution in ceramics for first 9 months? 29:38 29 minutes, 38 seconds Um overall about uh 29:45 29 minutes, 45 seconds if you see a blended rate it could be in the range of around 50 to 55%. 29:53 29 minutes, 53 seconds And industrial ceramics it could be as high as 75%. Because it's a combination of two businesses 30:03 30 minutes, 3 seconds right? Uh so second question on on the recently concluded the EU uh FDA and we 30:12 30 minutes, 12 seconds have uh exposure to Europe and uh in fact uh when we acquired the subsidiaries the we're talking about 30:19 30 minutes, 19 seconds synergies and cross-ell so any reading you have for your businesses uh from this FDA and uh uh if you could explain more uh could it be bene benefit to you? 30:33 30 minutes, 33 seconds Yeah. 30:33 30 minutes, 33 seconds So I I think um right now uh we it's it's so uh you know early at 30:41 30 minutes, 41 seconds this stage. So I feel overall FTA will be beneficial to us. Uh you know right 30:47 30 minutes, 47 seconds now uh we are uh under the MFN uh category. So hence definitely compared 30:54 30 minutes, 54 seconds to that rate MF and uh FDA rate will be definitely lower at least to the extent 31:01 31 minutes, 1 second of about four to 5% lower is what our uh which is definitely increases our 31:08 31 minutes, 8 seconds competitiveness hence it is more beneficial to us. 31:21 31 minutes, 21 seconds Hello. 31:22 31 minutes, 22 seconds Uh am audible. Hello. Uh no. Now you are audible. Yes. 31:30 31 minutes, 30 seconds Again you are not audible. I think some line issue is it. Go ahead with the question. 31:48 31 minutes, 48 seconds Amit if you have we can take the next question and then let him come on the queue. 31:53 31 minutes, 53 seconds Okay. Thank you Amit. The next question is from the line of Harshit Patel from Aquarius Securities. Please go ahead. 32:03 32 minutes, 3 seconds Hi sir. Uh thank you very much for the opportunity. Firstly on uh Auko and Rodius uh while you have outlined your 32:11 32 minutes, 11 seconds performance so far in the 9 months of FI26. 32:16 32 minutes, 16 seconds Can you broadly highlight how we should think about revenue growth and margin development for both these companies for the next year that is FYI 27? 32:28 32 minutes, 28 seconds Um I will share this details more in the next call. uh hashid because we we will 32:37 32 minutes, 37 seconds be doing the roll up at that time we'll be able to share at this time and uh 32:46 32 minutes, 46 seconds I I strongly feel that u the current challenge of uh AUKO which is like you 32:53 32 minutes, 53 seconds know a marginal topline growth is our uh key concern and I think uh we will 33:00 33 minutes reflect on that and uh when we meet uh in the next call we'll share this Yeah, 33:08 33 minutes, 8 seconds in terms of the next quarter which is the fourth quarter uh will it be broadly on similar lines as to what we have seen 33:16 33 minutes, 16 seconds in this third quarter or would there be a material improvement sequentially for the uh January to March quarter? 33:24 33 minutes, 24 seconds This is for the you talking about a correct both sir both AUKO as well as Rodia. 33:31 33 minutes, 31 seconds Yes. Yes. Okay. So, AUKO will be on the similar trend is what our uh reading I 33:39 33 minutes, 39 seconds you know uh is what and um we feel that uh the current trend would continue and 33:48 33 minutes, 48 seconds uh it could be better compared to the profitability because of the 33:53 33 minutes, 53 seconds um you know the expenses getting uh spread over the you know production 34:00 34 minutes process because last quarter we did not manufactured. So hence the fixep cost absorption was practically zero. So that 34:09 34 minutes, 9 seconds was the cost but uh you know going forward that would be a slight benefit on that but top line we are expecting to 34:17 34 minutes, 17 seconds be on the similar trend and as far as rodius is concerned I I 34:25 34 minutes, 25 seconds feel the uh normally Q4 is better quarter compared to the Q3 because Q3 uh 34:33 34 minutes, 33 seconds is a is a Christmas quarter. So that uh benefit I expect that it would come in terms of the top line. 34:43 34 minutes, 43 seconds Understood. 34:45 34 minutes, 45 seconds Sec. Secondly on uh domestic abrasives uh China has recently removed the export 34:53 34 minutes, 53 seconds rebate on abrasive products including grinding wheels from 9% to 0%. This will 35:00 35 minutes be in effect from April onwards. Can this translate into a tangible improvement in the domestic market share for us over time? 35:11 35 minutes, 11 seconds So this is the uh uh is a positive news as far as uh the Indian market is 35:19 35 minutes, 19 seconds concerned in across I mean this is one such product but many products the export benefit drop would benefit this. 35:28 35 minutes, 28 seconds So we think that u you know this is a positive information and it would definitely help us to strengthen our position. 35:39 35 minutes, 39 seconds Unders uh lastly uh oncore zirconia uh this particular business has continued 35:46 35 minutes, 46 seconds to impact our margins and profits negatively. Even in the first half of FI26 we have incurred a PBT loss of 35:55 35 minutes, 55 seconds around 25 crores. uh in INR terms on top of that there is further loss in the third quarter as well. So what is the 36:04 36 minutes, 4 seconds outlook on this business and how do we plan to improve the performance here? I remember few years ago we had also 36:12 36 minutes, 12 seconds planned to divest this particular business but I think since then uh nothing has happened on that front. So 36:20 36 minutes, 20 seconds if you can provide some outlook uh on this business that will be very helpful. 36:27 36 minutes, 27 seconds Yeah, I think it's a good uh question. 36:30 36 minutes, 30 seconds So, uh Fossar does troubles us a lot uh and definitely 36:37 36 minutes, 37 seconds impacting us. Um so right now what we are doing is they 36:44 36 minutes, 44 seconds have two products uh Z C and Z 450 and ZC is uh having higher losses. So we have closed down that operation. 36:57 36 minutes, 57 seconds and uh we are only focusing on Z450. 37:01 37 minutes, 1 second So the Q4 will have only Z450 operation and we want to see how that performance 37:09 37 minutes, 9 seconds is if if it is going to improve uh that is fine. If not we need to take a phone 37:16 37 minutes, 16 seconds call. Uh so this is what uh our current uh approach is. 37:24 37 minutes, 24 seconds Underscore sir. Uh thank you very much. I will come back in the question. Thank you. 37:30 37 minutes, 30 seconds Thank you. Participants who wish to ask a question may press star and one at this time. 37:38 37 minutes, 38 seconds To ask a question you may press star and one now. 37:50 37 minutes, 50 seconds The next question is from the line of Hititt Patel from IQ Securities. Please go ahead. 37:57 37 minutes, 57 seconds Uh thank you very much sir again for the followup. Uh sir in the uh domestic uh electro minerals business uh what is the 38:05 38 minutes, 5 seconds mix between domestic revenues and exports within our standalone business also? Is there any material difference in margins between these two? 38:17 38 minutes, 17 seconds So the yes the the mix is improving more towards the export that is helping us uh 38:26 38 minutes, 26 seconds uh a lot. I think um our aim is to have a 38:32 38 minutes, 32 seconds uh a 30% mix um that is 30% export mix 38:39 38 minutes, 39 seconds um on a long-term basis. that the current uh trend shows that even now we are very close to that. 38:51 38 minutes, 51 seconds Understood. So uh sir uh secondly uh in our standalone ceramics business uh 38:57 38 minutes, 57 seconds which has barely grew by around 1 and a half to 2% in the first 9 months of FI26. So could you highlight the 39:07 39 minutes, 7 seconds performance and growth rates of different sub segments namely refractories where ceramics industrial ceramics if you could give us a flavor 39:16 39 minutes, 16 seconds on which of the segments have grown and which haven't and uh based on your assessment how FI27 will look like for all these sub segments. 39:30 39 minutes, 30 seconds Yeah, I think um so um 39:36 39 minutes, 36 seconds we have uh two broad you know segments within that which is uh ceramic and refractories 39:45 39 minutes, 45 seconds but uh you know the way we discussed in the last few calls 39:51 39 minutes, 51 seconds um the set of businesses where engineer ceramics uh some of the fire refractories all 39:59 39 minutes, 59 seconds growth uh we are looking at uh a north of 20%. 40:06 40 minutes, 6 seconds Our challenge continues to lie in the V ceramic 40:12 40 minutes, 12 seconds and also the project based uh fired refractory business 40:20 40 minutes, 20 seconds punching of the product and that is happening or that's going to happen in Q4 is one of the reason that we are 40:28 40 minutes, 28 seconds looking at a muted 9 months one. So we expect uh you know the fullear basis they will be strong. Um 40:38 40 minutes, 38 seconds where ceramics continues to have this challenge largely we feel that uh you know one uh the 40:47 40 minutes, 47 seconds ceramic business in US particularly in the last two quarters were sluggish. 40:54 40 minutes, 54 seconds the end customers on many projects have delayed and deferred because of the 41:01 41 minutes, 1 second uncert uncertaintity in the tariff uh not just because of us I'm just saying as a project we are only a small 41:10 41 minutes, 10 seconds supplier in that but there because they are going to face many import costs so a lot of them have deferred this uh trying 41:18 41 minutes, 18 seconds to get clarity in terms of how it is going to happen so that two quarters is 41:25 41 minutes, 25 seconds causing this challenge. We think the information we are getting is that people more and more now start uh you 41:32 41 minutes, 32 seconds know firming up their project and start moving ahead. So that should come back. 41:38 41 minutes, 38 seconds Uh so this is how I read uh the ceramic business as a whole. And um as we ged uh 41:48 41 minutes, 48 seconds you know u you know ceramic business in the we we've given a guidance at the 41:54 41 minutes, 54 seconds consolidated level but in the ceramic obviously uh India becomes the forming a 42:02 42 minutes, 2 seconds major portion we expect that overall growth rate we know that the current rate is 1.7% but we expect this to be in 42:11 42 minutes, 11 seconds the range of about 9 to 11% at a full level. 42:17 42 minutes, 17 seconds Understood, sir. Uh, thank you very much for answering my questions and all the very best. Thank you. 42:24 42 minutes, 24 seconds Thank you. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one. The next question is from the line of Jo 42:33 42 minutes, 33 seconds Jonas BHA from Bir Mutual Funds. Please go ahead. 42:41 42 minutes, 41 seconds Hi. Um thank you for the opportunity. Uh I hope I'm audible. Yes. Yes. Please go ahead. 42:48 42 minutes, 48 seconds Yeah. So, so you know would appreciate your comments you know while you said that you'll give out a separate guidance for both the businesses the aoko and 42:58 42 minutes, 58 seconds rodius is probably with the Q4 results and uh just like fossar do you sort of 43:04 43 minutes, 4 seconds have a time frame as to when you will keep evaluating these businesses whether they uh remain are are you know are are 43:13 43 minutes, 13 seconds something that are sort of uh meeting the uh targets that you'd set out at the time of their acquisition as 43:22 43 minutes, 22 seconds in you bought them for a particular reason and I know maybe 3 years or 4 years is not a good enough time to sort 43:29 43 minutes, 29 seconds of evaluate these businesses because we buy it for the long term but you know just curious to know as to you know what are the steps that you're taking to sort 43:38 43 minutes, 38 seconds of see that whether these fit probably uh just like you're going to take a call on Fosskar so what is the timeline that you've given yourself uh on on this. 43:50 43 minutes, 50 seconds Yeah, I think again a good question. Uh, first as I communicated uh probably one 43:58 43 minutes, 58 seconds quarter to two quarter we will take a call and uh AU we think that uh you know 44:05 44 minutes, 5 seconds we should take a firm call in a year's time. 44:11 44 minutes, 11 seconds Understood. And uh you know just out of curiosity is sir again you know what is the cap you know while we bought it for I think five or six million euros what 44:20 44 minutes, 20 seconds has been the total loss funding that we've done in so far or the losses that we would have incurred in the last 3 4 years ever since we acquired them 44:29 44 minutes, 29 seconds yeah I think we have uh incurred a loss of close to about 30 million euro and uh 44:38 44 minutes, 38 seconds that this is over the last 4 years period. Sure. 44:43 44 minutes, 43 seconds Sure. Uh my second question sir was on ceramics. You know uh we in in about two 44:52 44 minutes, 52 seconds years back so we've seen a phenomenal growth and for the past four five years up until maybe fiscal 24 uh you know and 45:00 45 minutes predominantly driven by by these uh new age applications in SOFC cells etc. 45:09 45 minutes, 9 seconds uh the the the business of the company that was giving us those orders seemed to be booming. uh is is it already 45:17 45 minutes, 17 seconds reflective in the uh sales of ceramics for the past two quarters or you know that is something that that's the upside 45:26 45 minutes, 26 seconds that's potentially going to come uh going forward because you know again uh the communication was that the intensity 45:34 45 minutes, 34 seconds of ceramics in in these products is likely to go up and you know our wallet shares will sort of tend higher so I'm just again wanting to know whether 45:43 45 minutes, 43 seconds that's already reflective of uh the upside in in the last two three quarters. 45:50 45 minutes, 50 seconds So I I think uh um your pointed observation is well noted. 45:57 45 minutes, 57 seconds I think on the ceramic side uh the businesses that we are serving to SOFC's 46:06 46 minutes, 6 seconds and some of the high-end one they are growing pretty high you know as I said it's north of 20% is the growth that we 46:14 46 minutes, 14 seconds are having and uh we also have a very sizable good order book in fact we 46:21 46 minutes, 21 seconds backed the highest ever order in the last uh quarter from them so we we we seem to be doing fine there. Our 46:29 46 minutes, 29 seconds challenge as I explained to you comes largely from the V ceramic side uh which is uh what is causing and probably once 46:39 46 minutes, 39 seconds the project starts kicking in in a brace sorry in America uh I think this should 46:47 46 minutes, 47 seconds start uh getting better and then you would start seeing the overall growth would also start looking better. So two 46:56 46 minutes, 56 seconds broad reasons um one is that side the other side is the refractory projects bunching that is happening in Q4. So 47:05 47 minutes, 5 seconds that these are the two broad reason why we are seeing a muted growth up to 9 months. Still I'm as I gated on standalone 9 to 11% on a basis ceramic. 47:18 47 minutes, 18 seconds we will still do that because you will see a strong Q4 on that. Uh and then you will start seeing a better growth in 47:27 47 minutes, 27 seconds FI27 and uh some of the businesses that you are hinting are really supporting our growth well. 47:36 47 minutes, 36 seconds Got it fer appreciate your responses and all the best sir. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. 47:42 47 minutes, 42 seconds Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, if you wish to ask a question, you may press star and one at this time. 47:52 47 minutes, 52 seconds To ask a question, please press star and one. Now, 48:05 48 minutes, 5 seconds as there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. 48:14 48 minutes, 14 seconds Good. I think uh thank you all for participating. I would like to summarize as followers. I think um of course you 48:23 48 minutes, 23 seconds don't have the business plan but we are tracking to the business plan at uh 9 months level and uh we think that uh you 48:31 48 minutes, 31 seconds know we have uh worked on all the major efforts in terms of our long-term 48:39 48 minutes, 39 seconds strategy for ceramics electrominerals and abrasives 48:46 48 minutes, 46 seconds capacities are being created and we our investments progresses is very much in line. That's why we are also maintaining the guidance of 350 crores. 48:58 48 minutes, 58 seconds All the programs in terms of uh technology tieups working with uh you know partners in uh 49:06 49 minutes, 6 seconds two broad areas are all progressing well. 49:10 49 minutes, 10 seconds people uh addition and getting uh uh you know key leaders part of this uh new and 49:17 49 minutes, 17 seconds uh improved programs that we are looking at are all also happening in parallel. 49:23 49 minutes, 23 seconds So I would say while we focus on the current and the future also we are 49:30 49 minutes, 30 seconds securing well abrasive uh growth in Q3 is encouraging. We think that this trend should continue. 49:40 49 minutes, 40 seconds uh we feel Q4 will be a strong quarter for ceramics uh because of the based on the projects that that they have uh tied 49:48 49 minutes, 48 seconds up. Electrominerals is showing a good uh comeback very good margin recovery that 49:54 49 minutes, 54 seconds they have shown. Um their ROC's are also looking good. So overall standalone has 50:02 50 minutes, 2 seconds done an exceptional uh job. We think that Q4 could be better in in standalone. We do have challenges uh at 50:12 50 minutes, 12 seconds um Poscar, Zukonia, Aoko and I think um we would uh take appropriate actions on 50:21 50 minutes, 21 seconds on this. Rodius uh is doing fine but I think we need to we can get better at 50:28 50 minutes, 28 seconds it. We will do work on that. So with that background I thank you for all your 50:35 50 minutes, 35 seconds uh patience and time in the attending this call. Thank you on behalf of DAM Capital Advisors Limited. That concludes this conference. 50:45 50 minutes, 45 seconds Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.