Muthoot Finance Ltd — Q4 FY26

Muthoot Finance Ltd Q4 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEeb9GVxB8o Published: 14 hours ago

0:01 1 second Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Mutur Finance Q4 FY26 earnings conference call hosted by DAM Capital Advisers. 0:09 9 seconds As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. 0:18 18 seconds Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing start then zero on your Touchstone phone. 0:26 26 seconds I now hand the conference over to Sange Jedha from Dam Capital Advisor. Thank you and over to you sir. 0:34 34 seconds Yeah. Hi and very good evening to all of you. Uh we have with us uh the entire management team of motor finance today uh to discuss that you for uh results. 0:44 44 seconds Uh I'll hand the call over to Mr. George Alend uh for opening remarks. Uh we'll follow 0:51 51 seconds that up with question and answer. Uh over to you sir. 0:56 56 seconds Okay. Uh thank you sit and also uh welcome to the conference call of MUT finance and subsidiaries for the quarter 4 and the full year 202526. 1:10 1 minute, 10 seconds We just uh concluded our board meeting and that is the reason the uh the 1:16 1 minute, 16 seconds accounts the results were uh uploaded maybe an hour back or on India back only 1:24 1 minute, 24 seconds sorry for that but otherwise coming commenting on the on the business uh I will start with the gold loan business 1:33 1 minute, 33 seconds uh we have a we the highest ever consolidated gold loan AU consolidated gold loan AM of Mut Finance and its 1:41 1 minute, 41 seconds subsidiaries at 1 lak 65,000 crores which is a historic growth and has a 1:48 1 minute, 48 seconds growth of 57,000 crores or 54% last year. The full year uh our growth was 1:56 1 minute, 56 seconds 57,000 57,000 crores and the AUM consolidated stands at 1 lakh 65,000 crores. 2:04 2 minutes, 4 seconds Looking at the standalone business without the subsidiaries, the loan standalone gold loan uh loans 2:13 2 minutes, 13 seconds stands at 1 lakh 64,000 crores and the highest ever standalone profit after tax 2:20 2 minutes, 20 seconds standalone profit after tax of 10,134 crores. It is up by 95% yearon year. 2:29 2 minutes, 29 seconds Cons coming to the consolidated AUM. The consolidated AUM of MTU Finance and all 2:35 2 minutes, 35 seconds its subsidiaries stands at 1 lakh 81,916 crores as of March which shows a growth 2:43 2 minutes, 43 seconds of 59,000 crores or 49% last year and the consolidated profit after tax stands 2:50 2 minutes, 50 seconds at 10,607 crores again up by 98% yearonear. 2:57 2 minutes, 57 seconds Now a few other highlights uh I would like to add here. Mutt Finance declared a the highest dividend 3:06 3 minutes, 6 seconds of of 300% or 30 per share and this is the 14th year of consistent dividend declaration since our IPO in 2011. 3:18 3 minutes, 18 seconds During the year we opened 177 new branches by the group and 3:26 3 minutes, 26 seconds uh we also have received multiple industry recognitions as Mut Finance is certified as India's most trusted 3:35 3 minutes, 35 seconds financial services brand for 10th year in a row by TR brandust report 2026. 3:42 3 minutes, 42 seconds Also, Mut Finance has been certified as a great place to work by great place to work institute for the fifth year in a row. 3:51 3 minutes, 51 seconds Coming to the subsidiaries, there has been stable performance across the subsidiaries in Belar Micro finance just as we had 4:00 4 minutes guided last year. We have started opening started venturing into the gold loan business and we opened 81 gold loan 4:09 4 minutes, 9 seconds branches last year to diversify the loan portfolio. The total branches 4:16 4 minutes, 16 seconds including the uh the micro finance stands at 1300300. 4:22 4 minutes, 22 seconds Collection efficiency in the micro finance increased by 69% and now stands at 99.85%. 4:30 4 minutes, 30 seconds which was 99.16% last year. 4:36 4 minutes, 36 seconds During the year, we dispersed 7,500 crores as against 6,000 crores in the previous year. 4:44 4 minutes, 44 seconds Okay. And Mut Home Finance, the loan AO stands at 3,485 crores versus 2,900 in the last year, a growth of 17%. 4:55 4 minutes, 55 seconds Dispersed load of 999 crores last year. 4:59 4 minutes, 59 seconds Interest income increased by 36% profit after tax stands at 45 crores. GNPA 5:06 5 minutes, 6 seconds stands at 2.63 and NNPA at 1.94. 5:15 5 minutes, 15 seconds Now coming to Mut money. Mut money which is doing vehicle finance has has been running down it vehicle finance business 5:24 5 minutes, 24 seconds and has gone into the gold loan business and gold loan the AUM stands at at 9,794 5:32 5 minutes, 32 seconds crores versus 3,900 crores last year a growth of 151%. 5:39 5 minutes, 39 seconds There has been a share capital infusion of 1,000 crores being a 100% subsidiary. 5:45 5 minutes, 45 seconds It was in it was infused by the parent Mut Finance and today the capital base stands at 2,357 crores. 5:55 5 minutes, 55 seconds Total income increased to 1,294 crores. 5:59 5 minutes, 59 seconds Active customer base has shown a c consistent growth from 2.74 lakhs last year to 4.6 lakhs this year. 6:08 6 minutes, 8 seconds The credit rating has been upgraded to double A stable from double A double A plus stable from double A stable by 6:17 6 minutes, 17 seconds crescent for long-term borrowings. The profit after tax stood at 338 crores 6:23 6 minutes, 23 seconds this year versus 12 crores last year. So these are the main highlights of uh this 6:30 6 minutes, 30 seconds year. Uh we uh we are happy to present or we are glad to present a good financials for 6:39 6 minutes, 39 seconds last year and uh definitely thanking the uh the stakeholders including our 6:46 6 minutes, 46 seconds customers, our lenders, regulators and of course our uh valid shareholders and 6:53 6 minutes, 53 seconds also the uh bankers who have been funding us and certainly all the analysts also for your guidance. So I 7:02 7 minutes, 2 seconds think I will stop here and uh maybe uh wait for the clarifications and Q&A from the investors. 7:14 7 minutes, 14 seconds Thank you very much. 7:17 7 minutes, 17 seconds We will now begin the question and answer session. 7:20 7 minutes, 20 seconds Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star N1 on the test telephone. 7:26 7 minutes, 26 seconds If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star N2. 7:31 7 minutes, 31 seconds Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question give assembles. 8:14 8 minutes, 14 seconds The first question is from Shuang Gupta from Prosper Wealth. Please go ahead. Hello. Yeah. 8:21 8 minutes, 21 seconds Yes, you are audible. Yes. Uh I have two questions. Uh first is basically what is the uh like expected guidance of uh 8:30 8 minutes, 30 seconds topline revenue and the margins for the next year and the second is like how will the recent uh uh like RPM recently 8:37 8 minutes, 37 seconds said not to buy gold. So how will it impact the motor finance overall uh revenue going ahead in the next year? 8:45 8 minutes, 45 seconds So I think generally uh we don't give a guidance on the uh on the margins and 8:53 8 minutes, 53 seconds the profit it's uh when the AM grows there will be definitely profit growth also. So generally we wouldn't we have 9:00 9 minutes not been giving the guidance of that uh in the previous years. Now your second question was about the uh gold uh 9:10 9 minutes, 10 seconds not to import gold. So I think the government of India has said that you should uh reduce the import of gold and 9:17 9 minutes, 17 seconds uh they have actually increased the uh the tax also from 6% to 15%. So because 9:26 9 minutes, 26 seconds because we don't finance any gold purchase we don't finance any gold bullion etc. It actually doesn't affect 9:33 9 minutes, 33 seconds the mut as we all as we have always been saying we we finance only the household 9:40 9 minutes, 40 seconds used ornaments of the public which is what we don't take coins and bullions and bars etc. So we finance only the 9:49 9 minutes, 49 seconds household ornaments which is still intact and there is reportedly about 25 to 30,000 tons of gold with us. So I 9:57 9 minutes, 57 seconds think there is good uh scope a good uh prospects for this business going forward also in spite of new uh new gold 10:06 10 minutes, 6 seconds or new import of gold being restricted. 10:12 10 minutes, 12 seconds Got it sir. Thanks. Thanks for answering the question. 10:16 10 minutes, 16 seconds Thank you. The next question is from Rushab Dossi from Nirmiti Investment Advisory LLP. Please go ahead Mr. Rush. 10:25 10 minutes, 25 seconds Yeah. Hi. Congrats on a great set of numbers. So, uh I've noticed that you have changed the presentation this time. 10:32 10 minutes, 32 seconds So, in the last presentation, there was a slide which used to give the average monthly dispersement and the average 10:39 10 minutes, 39 seconds monthly collection for the quarter. So, if you could just please help me with those numbers. And uh my second question 10:48 10 minutes, 48 seconds is that I'm noting that the yields have gone up again this quarter. So are there any NPA recoveries or ARC income which we've booked in this quarter? 11:01 11 minutes, 1 second Uh okay. So dispersement it will be something similar you know we have not looked at exact numbers. Uh the second question know was there any additional 11:10 11 minutes, 10 seconds income? So there was an auction income of about 50 crores arc I think it is 11:16 11 minutes, 16 seconds around 35 crores. So totally 85 crores and know there was some increase in the pricing also in the uh last quarter. 11:28 11 minutes, 28 seconds Okay. Could you share the dispersement number for the quarter? 11:36 11 minutes, 36 seconds I think it will be almost similar know to know previous quarters the trends around 18,000 crus or 11:45 11 minutes, 45 seconds I don't have the numbers exactly so I'll not be able to share uh right now okay yeah thanks 11:54 11 minutes, 54 seconds thank you the next question is from Aijitra from motila load please go ahead sir 12:01 12 minutes, 1 second uh good evening uh so thank you for taking my question uh so if could just help us understand uh how is the 12:08 12 minutes, 8 seconds competitive intensity in the gold uh finance sector trending. Now the reason for asking this is in the past you have 12:18 12 minutes, 18 seconds explained to us so many times that whenever gold prices go up uh the tonnage will come down something we've seen maybe this quarter as well. Uh 12:27 12 minutes, 27 seconds having said that we have also had other um goal financing NBFCs uh obviously much smaller than you but we are still 12:36 12 minutes, 36 seconds seeing tonnage growth come through for them. So if you could first uh uh help us understand how are the competitive 12:44 12 minutes, 44 seconds dynamics and why I ask this again sir is that uh in the past you've always said competition will come and go but not 12:52 12 minutes, 52 seconds everyone is very serious about gold financing uh they do it very opportunistically but this time around sir uh maybe for the first time we are 13:01 13 minutes, 1 second seeing uh a bunch of all AAA rated MBFCs who are themselves deep pocketed can 13:09 13 minutes, 9 seconds raise abilities at finer rates than ours and at some point in time can also build the distribution muscle uh which is very 13:18 13 minutes, 18 seconds important in gold financing. So if you could just put some of those pieces together for us sir. So 13:26 13 minutes, 26 seconds uh thank you and you actually asked the question and also give the answers also. 13:31 13 minutes, 31 seconds The competition is there new and newer people are coming fine. I I think I would repeat what I said earlier also. 13:39 13 minutes, 39 seconds We are a we are a gold company which is focused on gold loan. The new players 13:45 13 minutes, 45 seconds who are coming maybe deep pockets maybe lesser cost of funds they are not focused gold loan players. focused gold 13:54 13 minutes, 54 seconds on players and uh also gold loan players have a difference which people will realize after some time only because 14:02 14 minutes, 2 seconds this is a very operationally challenging operationally in intensive business and I'm sure people will realize that going 14:11 14 minutes, 11 seconds forward so competition will come after some time again I'm repeating some of them will lose interest some of them who 14:18 14 minutes, 18 seconds stay focused will definitely be able to do this do better So they are all opportunistic people. So we don't find 14:25 14 minutes, 25 seconds any people anybody taking away our business also because in spite of all these we have been growing 14:33 14 minutes, 33 seconds reasonably well if not better than the previous years. So we see uh continuous growth in this in this sector and uh we 14:42 14 minutes, 42 seconds see better things to happen. Now if you look at our slide number seven uh 19 slide number 19 you'll see when you 14:51 14 minutes, 51 seconds compare we have a second neck company which has started rollown business maybe one and a half years back Mut money the 15:00 15 minutes the row number two see Mut money the tage has increased considerably 15:07 15 minutes, 7 seconds so because the tage which was seven has gone up to 12. So that will be the same for any new player. So you consider this 15:15 15 minutes, 15 seconds also as a new player. New player you compare with mut money. So mut money the chall increase from 7 to 11. Whereas in 15:24 15 minutes, 24 seconds mut finance we are an established player. We are we having old legacy accounts with us and there the damage 15:33 15 minutes, 33 seconds will be definitely will be proportional to the new loans. So the churn churn in the loans the churn in the loan is actually for every four months it is 15:41 15 minutes, 41 seconds churned. So when every time a four month churn happens the new loans are created at a less higher STV that means they 15:50 15 minutes, 50 seconds need to give only lesser gold. So that is why you see the tonnage coming down. 15:54 15 minutes, 54 seconds See a person who had taken one lakh would have given me 10 g last year uh last year when he comes this time 16:01 16 minutes, 1 second instead of 10 grams he need to go only six g for the same load. So that is why the tonnage is coming down that I've been explaining always. But when you 16:09 16 minutes, 9 seconds said about the new companies in the new company you just compare mut money where the tonnage has also gone up. So the 16:17 16 minutes, 17 seconds amum which was about 3,700 has gone to 9,700. So tage has gone up the uh the 16:25 16 minutes, 25 seconds AUM has also gone up and the number of customers the number of customers in mut money was 274 in the last year. Today it 16:34 16 minutes, 34 seconds is 4 lakh 64. So both are growing because it's a new company young company. For Mut Finance the big the big 16:42 16 minutes, 42 seconds company the the number of customers not that easy to grow. There is something else also there because in mut finance 16:50 16 minutes, 50 seconds that all will account the smaller accounts with up to 10,000 and accounts from 10,000 to 30,000 actually we we 16:58 16 minutes, 58 seconds have lost about 15 lakh customers there but we have added the same in the higher tickets of 50,000 one lakh and two lakh 17:07 17 minutes, 7 seconds so overall that is the churn which is happening smaller loans people what somebody who took a 10,000 loan last 17:14 17 minutes, 14 seconds year today doesn't need 10,000 the the money value also has gone up. So he is coming for a 50,000 loan today or a 20,000 loan today. That is why the number of customers are are coming down. 17:26 17 minutes, 26 seconds So these are the views our views about the customers and about the uh tonnage and also I said about the new players and competition. 17:37 17 minutes, 37 seconds Okay. Thank you. And then the last question sir I had is I mean I can't hear you. We can't hear you. 17:46 17 minutes, 46 seconds Uh say versus Mr. Vijit. Is it is it better now? Yeah. Thank you. 17:53 17 minutes, 53 seconds Yeah. So the last question I had was uh on employee attrition. Uh I mean given that there are so many other NGFC's who 18:01 18 minutes, 1 second are also looking to uh start uh gold financing obviously they'll want to hire people from the best gold financing 18:09 18 minutes, 9 seconds company in India. to thank you for thank you for branding Mut Finance as the best gold finance 18:18 18 minutes, 18 seconds company. There is okay there is always some people going away but nothing of 18:25 18 minutes, 25 seconds any alarm because our numbers are also steady. If somebody goes we take a new person and again with competition some 18:33 18 minutes, 33 seconds people think that just by taking a few managers or staff from mut they can start a gold loan business and maybe 18:40 18 minutes, 40 seconds start branches okay I I'm not serving your comments now let us see what will happen what they will be looking after 2 18:47 18 minutes, 47 seconds years and 3 years we have not lost any att 18:55 18 minutes, 55 seconds 30,000 staff we still have Perfect sir and earlier sir had mentioned that the higher interest income that we saw 19:04 19 minutes, 4 seconds was also because of some higher pricing or pricing changes that we have done. So sir last quarter we increased our risk by 19:11 19 minutes, 11 seconds about 0.5 to 1% over certain certain types of loans. So that is why we see the yield has gone gone up. 19:20 19 minutes, 20 seconds Got it sir. This is useful. Thank you so much for answering all my questions and sir I wish you and your team the very best. Thank you. 19:28 19 minutes, 28 seconds Thank you. 19:31 19 minutes, 31 seconds The next question is from Pan Engineer from CLSA. Please go ahead. 19:37 19 minutes, 37 seconds Yeah. Hi team. Uh congrats on the quarter. Uh just sort of going back to the earlier questions uh this yield 19:44 19 minutes, 44 seconds movement from 20.34 to 76 is uh does this include no interest recovery numbers or is this just core? 19:56 19 minutes, 56 seconds No, there could be no know the regular churn which happens know uh previous occasions what happened is your has come 20:04 20 minutes, 4 seconds down know this time the NPS have gone up but know the one of cases will be uh you know one is the auction income 50 crores 20:12 20 minutes, 12 seconds and u uh know the what is the other thing uh the arc that is 35 crores and know the know the yield increase also 20:21 20 minutes, 21 seconds has happened you know uh during the quarter during the quarter Okay. Okay. So sir Omen sa the last 20:28 20 minutes, 28 seconds quarter we also had a 500 cr interest right back from G&PA recoveries that would be part of this 20.34 20:36 20 minutes, 36 seconds uh% yield number of last quarter is it last quarter yes but this quarter this quarter no that is not part of that 20:46 20 minutes, 46 seconds happened last year last quarter correct correct so if I adjust for that our yield improvement is very sharp. 20:55 20 minutes, 55 seconds Yeah.5 more than 100 we don't want to get into the specifics 21:02 21 minutes, 2 seconds of the yield increase. So you know last two quarters I know there have been know lot of increase in the gold price 21:09 21 minutes, 9 seconds especially in last fourth quarter. So know we have charged some extra uh for 21:16 21 minutes, 16 seconds uh those dispersements. Uh to that extent we got some extra benefits. 21:23 21 minutes, 23 seconds Understood. And sir, is there now that we've we are anyway earning a a pretty solid yield of 20.8%. 21:32 21 minutes, 32 seconds Is there a thought that we can maybe uh cut yields a bit and increase our customer count because our customer count has gone down. 21:43 21 minutes, 43 seconds This is something which we have always discussed. No, we have the lecture rate to reduce the rate you know. So that's why we always used to give a guidance of 21:50 21 minutes, 50 seconds know-m of around 3 and a half percentage. So you know of if if uh know the yield 21:57 21 minutes, 57 seconds reduction uh adds a lot of customer certainly we would like to do which we are already doing you know last several years we have been uh knowing schemes at 22:06 22 minutes, 6 seconds lower rate we have different schemes we have yield for 22% 23% we yield for 18% 15% 14% 12% 22:16 22 minutes, 16 seconds we have different so at some point of time when we feel when we feel that we need to step up the lower yield 22:22 22 minutes, 22 seconds portfolio we'll do So as as of date we don't need see any need for that now. 22:29 22 minutes, 29 seconds Understood. Understood. And sir just one last question. It's a just a technical thing on uh slide 28 22:36 22 minutes, 36 seconds where you talk about the margin of safety on loans from the lender's perspective. 22:42 22 minutes, 42 seconds Uh the the market price of the gold or Yeah. Your voice is cut off. 22:51 22 minutes, 51 seconds Uh yeah. So G your voice is cut off. Yeah. You now you audible. 22:56 22 minutes, 56 seconds Yeah. Yeah. So in that chart where you show the market price of gold ornaments which is 2634 billion rupees for March 23:04 23 minutes, 4 seconds 26. Is it as of 31st March or do you take a monthly average number? 23:10 23 minutes, 10 seconds No no that no. So we have put the price also in the table above. No. 13,441. As of the date also? As of 31st March. 23:19 23 minutes, 19 seconds That date sir. That date. as of the date not monthly average. Yeah. Yeah. That that that's it from my end. Uh thanks and wish you all the best. 23:30 23 minutes, 30 seconds Thank you. 23:33 23 minutes, 33 seconds The next question is from Rajiv Ma from Yes Securities. Please go ahead Mr. Rajiv. 23:39 23 minutes, 39 seconds Yeah. Hi, good evening. Congratulations on good numbers. You know again just you know looking at the customer metrics. I mean while the acquisition this quarter 23:48 23 minutes, 48 seconds is better you know reactivation of customer is better we we have still kind of begrown at the customer base level by 2%. So which means we're also seeing 23:56 23 minutes, 56 seconds slightly accelerated admission. Uh so I mean is there any observation around it that the customers uh already with us 24:05 24 minutes, 5 seconds are also moving to competition in the quest for uh better rates or the high value customers are moving out uh which is impacting not just the customer 24:14 24 minutes, 14 seconds number as well. It is also impacting the tonnage growth as well. Is there any observation like that by of the management? I think I just uh five 24:23 24 minutes, 23 seconds minutes back I explained even somebody did not ask that specifically but we explained that uh we have the customers 24:31 24 minutes, 31 seconds up to zero to 10,000 customers we have lost about uh five five lakh customers 24:38 24 minutes, 38 seconds and between 10,000 to 30,000 maybe another 8 lakh customers have gone out 24:46 24 minutes, 46 seconds but then if the customer total count is remaining same it only means that the customers in the other segments maybe 24:53 24 minutes, 53 seconds 50,000 1 lakh two lakhs have grown see very small customers or ara small customers they may tend to leave or 25:00 25 minutes maybe go away also what but that doesn't matter much to us because a customer of 10,000 or 30,000 leaving us maybe he 25:09 25 minutes, 9 seconds takes it off he either he comes again for a bigger loan or he does not come again but I don't know whether somebody is taking away the 30,000 customer or 25:18 25 minutes, 18 seconds 10,000 customers I don't think anybody Nobody would like to uh take such a small customer. So the point they were 25:25 25 minutes, 25 seconds saying was very ultra small customers, ultra small loan customers would have left but the medium and the good uh the 25:33 25 minutes, 33 seconds better customers are still growing with footprint. So okay give an example. So know suppose if know less than 10 know 25:41 25 minutes, 41 seconds less than 50,000 customers say 10 lakhs customers have left you would have added another 10 lakhs customers in the higher bucket. So netn net net if you see 25:49 25 minutes, 49 seconds because the smaller ticket price customers would have closed their load no which are large in number will not be able to match the exact same amount. So 25:56 25 minutes, 56 seconds this happens for a large portfolio company and new company you will not face. That's why in the previous question know 26:04 26 minutes, 4 seconds yeah we explained the know how mut money has grow. So know we just want to bring a comparison to the new players. If it 26:12 26 minutes, 12 seconds is a matured company large portfolio, the churn will happen in the portfolio know which is which is which will be 26:20 26 minutes, 20 seconds there a shift in customer basis from lower ticket size customers and you know higher ticket size customers. So this 26:27 26 minutes, 27 seconds plays know an important role and know in spite of this you know we have grown a little bit in terms of outstanding 26:34 26 minutes, 34 seconds number of cases know this is a natural phenomena which will happen in any portfolio which has become matured. 26:43 26 minutes, 43 seconds And just coming back to the E thing because the movement is so sharp and last quarter you had a major interest recovery as well which you don't have 26:50 26 minutes, 50 seconds this quarter. Uh but you raise the price uh so I mean I mean this NPN increase 26:58 26 minutes, 58 seconds which has happened in this quarter which is stage two has increased stage three is also significantly increased. Uh that would have given you some more interest income recognition maybe in this 27:07 27 minutes, 7 seconds quarter. But why did this uh you know why did we see an increase in stage two and stage three and so much in this quarters? Is there any fidarity around 27:14 27 minutes, 14 seconds it in terms of customer profile occupation or any geography? 27:18 27 minutes, 18 seconds No. So the stage three increase has happened know primarily because you know RBI has advised us to do a borrower wise classification. So earlier we were doing this classification at the loan level. 27:29 27 minutes, 29 seconds So today know we have this time we have done at the borrower level. So to that extent there is a uh inc increase in uh 27:38 27 minutes, 38 seconds know the NPS. So that's why there is a jump in the NPA. But if you look at percentage wise you know it is much 27:45 27 minutes, 45 seconds lower than what was there in the March 25. So know March 26 it is 2.35 34 I think uh know last year March it was 27:53 27 minutes, 53 seconds 3.35. So uh you know the NPA absolute amount has increased because of the borrow classification and this when you 28:01 28 minutes, 1 second do a borrow classification a lot of this uh know stage one and stage two customers also will be classed as an NPA 28:08 28 minutes, 8 seconds where there are no probably the interesting is done so the interest reversals will be much lower 28:16 28 minutes, 16 seconds correct and know if you look at know the the uh the uh LTV including on this NPA 28:25 28 minutes, 25 seconds bucket the including the interest acured it is only around 58%age so on stage three on stage three where we saw as a NPA the 28:35 28 minutes, 35 seconds interest plus principle is only 57%. So we are in the money but technically we have to or maybe regulatory wise we have 28:43 28 minutes, 43 seconds to show it as an NPA but it is 100% 100 100% recoverable with interest 28:52 28 minutes, 52 seconds just the customer has not come forward to maybe close the loan or renew the loan etc that is why it is seen as a 28:58 28 minutes, 58 seconds NP so if I were to look at your yield on a sustainable basis I just need to subtract 50 cr of auction and the 35 cr 29:07 29 minutes, 7 seconds of arc uh you know as being oneoffs but otherwise what you reported 20.2% 2% 29:14 29 minutes, 14 seconds yield uh should be largely uh sustainable unless you make some pricing changes, right? 29:21 29 minutes, 21 seconds Yeah. So pricing changes can happen. No, because it's a short-term loan. Yeah. 29:27 29 minutes, 27 seconds So this pricing increase in between happened because know there was a sudden price increase. No, we thought no we'll uh somehow we'll take some benefit out 29:35 29 minutes, 35 seconds of the the increase in the gold price increase in demand. Got it. Thank you so much investor. 29:46 29 minutes, 46 seconds Thank you sir. 29:49 29 minutes, 49 seconds The next question is from Sanscar from Ira Capital. Please go ahead. Hello. 29:55 29 minutes, 55 seconds Uh hi. Um so sir you touched upon uh the difference between uh like operational 30:03 30 minutes, 3 seconds challenges that a newer player would face. If you can share just a brief color around you know in terms of examples. I understand that there was 30:12 30 minutes, 12 seconds like handling goals and everything but apart from that is there any historically from your experience what 30:20 30 minutes, 20 seconds are the major challenges actually why we want to go into all these details sir anyway all this nuts 30:27 30 minutes, 27 seconds and bolts of it that I told you the new players will understand after one year or so let us wait for them that 30:34 30 minutes, 34 seconds why we should put words into their mouth let them understand it at that time Okay, understood. And if you can share 30:43 30 minutes, 43 seconds some uh color around the growth uh as you said on that you give guidance around a if you can share um growth guidance on that. 30:53 30 minutes, 53 seconds Always in the first quarter we have always been giving a guidance of 15% only. So as usual last 10 years you have 31:01 31 minutes, 1 second been giving 15% guidance in the first quarter. So let the in quarter two or quarter three we will see how it is panning out and probably revise it. 31:12 31 minutes, 12 seconds Okay. Thank you. 31:16 31 minutes, 16 seconds Thank you sir. The next question is from Joti Khatri from Ambit. Please go ahead. 31:28 31 minutes, 28 seconds Joti Kadri. Yeah please go ahead. 31:33 31 minutes, 33 seconds Yeah. Uh thank you sir. Thanks for taking my questions. Just wanted to know one thing. Uh this uh stage one, stage 31:40 31 minutes, 40 seconds two, stage three increase that you said that it is because of uh borrower wise classification. Is that the only reason 31:47 31 minutes, 47 seconds apart from that asset quality you want to use state? 31:52 31 minutes, 52 seconds That's why we said no on stage three assets including the interest dues know it is only know 60%age. 32:00 32 minutes No maybe 50 58%age. 32:04 32 minutes, 4 seconds So receivable including principal and interest is only 58% of the present market value of the gold. 32:11 32 minutes, 11 seconds So it is not because of any uh uh any impairment in the loan etc. It is only 32:18 32 minutes, 18 seconds because of the regulatory uh regulatory guidance that it should be shown as an MP. 32:26 32 minutes, 26 seconds Okay. So I'm saying excluding that factor the uh I mean otherwise the asset 32:33 32 minutes, 33 seconds quality comments is uh stable. Oh 100% 100% all we do we have our audit 32:40 32 minutes, 40 seconds team also so asset quality has always been stable wherever there is any any anything else we just write off at that time. 32:50 32 minutes, 50 seconds And secondly sir, how do you see uh AUM growth as a standalone entry and console AUM? Any guidance that you would like to 32:59 32 minutes, 59 seconds you know put for next broad range? How do you anticipate how AUM grow to AUM to grow next year? 33:07 33 minutes, 7 seconds So for the standalone mut finance we have been always been giving a guidance of 15% last 10 years in the first 33:15 33 minutes, 15 seconds quarter we have always been giving a guidance of 15%. We will continue to do that. We will reook at it in Q2 or Q3 33:27 33 minutes, 27 seconds Q1 or Q2. After Q1 or after Q2, we will relook at the same. 33:34 33 minutes, 34 seconds Thank you sir. Thank you. 33:39 33 minutes, 39 seconds The next question is from Nishant Chavate from Kek. Please go ahead. 33:45 33 minutes, 45 seconds Hi. Uh thanks for taking my question. uh you know a couple of questions actually uh any any any strategy or any guidance 33:52 33 minutes, 52 seconds on branch expansion year and after yeah okay so probably last year we opened 170 34:01 34 minutes, 1 second branches or so this year maybe uh 200 300 branches that's it 34:08 34 minutes, 8 seconds okay maybe 200 300 versus 170 and this will be at the uh at at at mut finance level right I mean would you 34:17 34 minutes, 17 seconds And maybe if you could give some some guidance on consolidated gold branches across all the companies. 34:23 34 minutes, 23 seconds I think we were thinking of opening another 200 branches or so because it has only about 100 branches. So which is 34:30 34 minutes, 30 seconds a micro finance company and Mut money I don't think we are aggressively looking at just because the branches are quite 34:39 34 minutes, 39 seconds young. So we are waiting for it to mature a little more before opening many branches there and and and Benstar 200 will be gold branches. 34:48 34 minutes, 48 seconds Yeah gold branches sorry sorry gold branches gold branches. 34:51 34 minutes, 51 seconds Okay got it. So essentially around roughly 200 in Mud Finance and roughly 200 instar I think that's the way one thinks about. Yeah something like that. 35:00 35 minutes Got it. Uh the other thing is uh you know increase in stage two loans uh would also be similar reasons uh you know uh in terms of uh you know the 35:09 35 minutes, 9 seconds borrower classification or any other reason. 35:12 35 minutes, 12 seconds Yes. Yes. Yes. N primarily it has because of uh borrower classification and again know it is not a much of a concern no because it's a 12-month 35:21 35 minutes, 21 seconds bullet repayment loan. you know as in when the dispersements keeps increasing know naturally after 12 months there will be a uh corresponding gem in the uh 35:30 35 minutes, 30 seconds stages but all the increase is in gold loans right stage two and stage three quarter and quarter increase that we see is in gold loans right I mean not the not the 35:39 35 minutes, 39 seconds non gold and any anything specific that's growing in non- gold loans I think which is also up around 3,000 or in a year so anything specific that you are doing 35:48 35 minutes, 48 seconds over there these are unsecured loans or what are these loans these are unsecured personal loans, salary personal loan and unsecured 35:55 35 minutes, 55 seconds personal loans which is doing actually quite well. We have about 4,000 cr of portfolios mostly cross 36:03 36 minutes, 3 seconds crossell it is mainly cross it's mainly a cross cell to our existing or uh or gold loan base we have a gold loan base 36:12 36 minutes, 12 seconds we have uh we uh give personal loans uh to them 36:20 36 minutes, 20 seconds cross and just finally on uh you know coming back to the yield part you know you always kind of maintain that you know 36:28 36 minutes, 28 seconds 188 18 and a half% is probably a more normalized yield and obviously we have done almost 150 or 200 basis points higher this quarter. So would you kind 36:36 36 minutes, 36 seconds of incrementally say that you know the 20 plus is a new normal or would you would you probably say that you know next year you would settle somewhere between 18 and a half to 20? 36:45 36 minutes, 45 seconds I think uh finance treasury finance says that uh the borrowing cost is looking 36:52 36 minutes, 52 seconds north up north. So probably uh we expect uh borrowing cost also may go up in the coming so probably uh we may not be able 37:01 37 minutes, 1 second to reduce anymore. We may be able to maintain at this rate on a more normalized level. Yeah. 37:12 37 minutes, 12 seconds Sure. Great. Thank you very much. Thank you. 37:17 37 minutes, 17 seconds The next question is from Vikram Subramanyan from Marshall W. Please go ahead. 37:26 37 minutes, 26 seconds Hello. Uh hi sir. Uh congrats on a good set of numbers and um on the strong yields. Uh I just wanted to get a 37:34 37 minutes, 34 seconds clarification on the yields um based on all that you have been commenting till now. Uh so for the past three quarters 37:42 37 minutes, 42 seconds we have had a few one-offs in the um uh yield um from 300 to 600 crores per 37:50 37 minutes, 50 seconds quarter uh based on NPA recoveries and uh ARC sales. Um you used to say so the 37:59 37 minutes, 59 seconds sustainable level of yield was something around 18.5%. while the reported yields were 20 20.3. 38:08 38 minutes, 8 seconds Um would you upgrade that 18.5% now for the next year or for a 38:15 38 minutes, 15 seconds sustainable basis? Is that 18.5 now closer to 20.5? 38:22 38 minutes, 22 seconds It's not no this number is not that particular. It's not like a long-term loan where we are giving a loan for you know 10 years or 5 years or 20 years. 38:32 38 minutes, 32 seconds See this is a very short term tomorrow if we want to know increase it we can increase it you know we may also reduce it you know what is the impact because 38:40 38 minutes, 40 seconds of things we have a comfortable margin you know know this quarter I think we have generated RO of around 7 and a half 38:48 38 minutes, 48 seconds so know it doesn't matter much in terms of ultimate impact on the return asset so uh we don't want to give a view that 38:57 38 minutes, 57 seconds know the same rates will continue because you know again know to be very frank can know you you know the some of the um analyst I've just now asked on 39:06 39 minutes, 6 seconds the competition the customer base acquisition etc. So we as an institution might take calls in different points of time. So we don't want to give a 39:14 39 minutes, 14 seconds commitment that you know the the the the same yields will be maintained. 39:20 39 minutes, 20 seconds Understood. Understood. But at least uh to clarify on that uh the pricing increase that you took at uh some point 39:29 39 minutes, 29 seconds in time in the past few months which has resulted in this yield. uh as we speak 39:35 39 minutes, 35 seconds as of miday that pricing uh has not reverted back to the previous lower 39:42 39 minutes, 42 seconds pricing am I right in this understanding know see we know think from our point we don't want to give out our strategy in 39:50 39 minutes, 50 seconds terms of approach you know because it's a uh know as everyone say it is a highly competitive market so know what we roll 39:58 39 minutes, 58 seconds out probably we can tell you know uh after we know uh execute We generally have to apply by the year also. 40:07 40 minutes, 7 seconds That means year means e so understood. Understood. 40:13 40 minutes, 13 seconds And that thing coming. It's all very short-term loan. We can it is always can be dynamic. We can reduce we can increase etc as required for so that we 40:23 40 minutes, 23 seconds maintain a good growth as well as maintain a good uh profit. 40:29 40 minutes, 29 seconds I think that decision you should leave it to us. You know every quarter you look at the numbers you know we can explain what has happened you know and know take a view based on the 40:38 40 minutes, 38 seconds performance in the last several quarters. 40:42 40 minutes, 42 seconds Understood. Got it sir. Uh just another clarification this is on the uh competitive uh landscape which has again 40:50 40 minutes, 50 seconds been discussed and you were very clear in your answer and uh it is very clear that you are the market leader um and 40:58 40 minutes, 58 seconds you uh you have done this for multiple decades. So that experience definitely helps over cycles. uh but in the 41:06 41 minutes, 6 seconds immediate near term uh are there any uh specific efforts to stop this? So I see 41:14 41 minutes, 14 seconds uh 3% reduction in loan count, 2% reduction in active customer. Are there any specific efforts to stop this or uh 41:24 41 minutes, 24 seconds is the approach more long-term and that uh competitive intensity would just course correct over the long term? 41:31 41 minutes, 31 seconds So know let me yeah I'll clarify. See what we were trying to explain is see you know being a large portfolio company being in 41:40 41 minutes, 40 seconds existence for several decades you know we have custom base across various ticket size. Now what happens is you 41:47 41 minutes, 47 seconds know the smaller ticket size customers you know vanish over a period of time you know at the same time we are creating uh know higher ticket size 41:54 41 minutes, 54 seconds customers also probably because the smaller ticket size customers were initially larger in know number you know 42:01 42 minutes, 1 second there the liquidation know brings down the customer number uh you know in a large has a larger impact whereas the 42:09 42 minutes, 9 seconds higher ticket size customer the number may not be corresponding the same. So which you know which we call it as a churn in the customer base. So that 42:18 42 minutes, 18 seconds number has not much of a relevance you know ultimately it depends on you know how much a customer wants etc. So 42:25 42 minutes, 25 seconds incremental this this phenomena will happen for all you know companies which will stabilize their business operations 42:33 42 minutes, 33 seconds after some time. That's why we said you know look at mutan's case you know the tage is increasing slide number 19 slide number 19 mut money the am is you 42:42 42 minutes, 42 seconds know almost doubled you know there you are seeing a increase in the tage there you are seeing increase in the loan account numbers there you are seeing increase in the customer base but the 42:51 42 minutes, 51 seconds same percentage increase you will not see happening in mut finance no it is you know the same group the same management know two different phenomena 43:00 43 minutes which is what we are trying to educate uh the know the investor community how this business functions. 43:09 43 minutes, 9 seconds Understood. That's that's that's okay. Got it. Thank you. Thanks for that. Thank you. 43:17 43 minutes, 17 seconds The next question is from Shepal Doohi from IQirus. Please go ahead Mr. Shupal. 43:23 43 minutes, 23 seconds Hi sir. Uh thank you for giving me the opportunity. My question was firstly uh on the uh what is the interest approval 43:30 43 minutes, 30 seconds number during the quarter? Any other questions? 43:40 43 minutes, 40 seconds And the other question is that how many muted money branches overlap with muted finance in terms of let's say having it 43:47 43 minutes, 47 seconds in 1 kilometer or 2 kilometer radius and and the other follow up there or addition there is that now since there 43:55 43 minutes, 55 seconds is no cap in terms of mut being allowed to or or let's say needing to take a approval from RBI in terms of grant 44:02 44 minutes, 2 seconds expansion then why are we thinking to do gold business in the subsidiaries that 44:09 44 minutes, 9 seconds we have uh can we I mean what is your thought process that there because now we can scale up the mus finance itself 44:18 44 minutes, 18 seconds right so that's that's a that's an advice on a policy decision I think we have to discuss it 44:25 44 minutes, 25 seconds internally only you have to just wanted to understand like what the difference is there 44:34 44 minutes, 34 seconds I think that's a board decision and uh that company's intimate decision let us leave it to Now your question is about the 44:41 44 minutes, 41 seconds interse 963 crores. 963 and and the branch overlap within 1 44:49 44 minutes, 49 seconds kilometer radius for for both the entities finance and money broader if you can give some color there I don't 44:57 44 minutes, 57 seconds know where you got we we have branches where know we have uh no mut finance we have uh no goldon 45:07 45 minutes, 7 seconds number two golden number three in the same building so Okay. 45:14 45 minutes, 14 seconds Same building you will have all the competitors. Whenever Mutu finance opens a branch all the competitors open branch 45:20 45 minutes, 20 seconds side by side if possible next door or if possible 20 ft, 30 ft, 50 ft. There is nothing like a 1 kilometer, 2 km etc. 45:30 45 minutes, 30 seconds Where muti saw an opportunity they opened the branch irrespective of whether mut finance is there or competitor number one, competitor number 45:39 45 minutes, 39 seconds two, competitor number 10 is there. so many competitions today. 45:45 45 minutes, 45 seconds Got it. Got it. Just one last question was on this uh the newer framework by RBI in terms of the gold financing player for the gold financing players. 45:55 45 minutes, 55 seconds So from 1 we are supposed to maintain or monitor the LTVs more closely. So what are the ch what are the uh you know 46:04 46 minutes, 4 seconds challenges are we facing at ground level or what are the deviations that we've made in terms of our processes policies or operations point standpoint at at 46:12 46 minutes, 12 seconds branch level so I think the policy has been quite good uh the LTV maintaining has been 46:20 46 minutes, 20 seconds from the last 10 years or uh 15 years back only the LTV came till from that date till today we are always 46:28 46 minutes, 28 seconds maintaining the LTV at RBA regulated rates only. Now they have given an 46:34 46 minutes, 34 seconds option of giving 85% 80% etc. So that is gives us little more room for giving uh 46:42 46 minutes, 42 seconds different types of uh LTVs and loan products to the customer. That's the only advantage. Now the processes for 46:49 46 minutes, 49 seconds that the software for that was is not easy. We are also in the process of doing it. We have uh rolled out some uh 46:58 46 minutes, 58 seconds products also. So going forward we can we can uh what should I say tailor make more products for the customers. So last 47:06 47 minutes, 6 seconds night Mut everybody else is also coming out with newer newer loan schemes 47:12 47 minutes, 12 seconds etc in line with the uh with the new regulations. But your first question we always whether it is now or before this 47:21 47 minutes, 21 seconds new regulation or previously always been maintaining the LTV at the regulator rates only. 47:29 47 minutes, 29 seconds Got it. Got it. So can I just squeeze in one more question here if you don't mind? 47:34 47 minutes, 34 seconds Yeah. So, so the last question was if we have taken an interest uh like rate increase during the quarter and since we're also following the final framework 47:42 47 minutes, 42 seconds by RBI uh our disbbursement yield would have our dispersement LTVs would have declined uh on a sequential basis right 47:50 47 minutes, 50 seconds because uh if you've taken an interest in interest rate increase then the actual diseasement LTV typically would have come down now so is is that a fair 47:59 47 minutes, 59 seconds understanding and incrementally if we follow this uh our LTV will continue to be sticky uh with with rates twing happening at your level. 48:10 48 minutes, 10 seconds Know the new regulations know allows you to follow two structures. You know if you are following a bullet tree you have to reduce the uh interest acured and 48:18 48 minutes, 18 seconds know there also know various options are available. If you are following a EMA structure you can give up to 85%age you 48:25 48 minutes, 25 seconds know I'm talking about 2A 50,000 right right customer. So you know so we have made some changes but know at the end of the 48:33 48 minutes, 33 seconds day it know it is in our interest to protect our interest right right so we'll take care of that you know we'll discuss after first quarter on 48:41 48 minutes, 41 seconds that you know the strategies you know based on terms with the new regulation got it I I'll maybe take it offline with 48:50 48 minutes, 50 seconds you sir if you don't mind thank you thank you sir thank you the next question is from 48:57 48 minutes, 57 seconds Shilkumar Sha from Shamika Capital please go ahead. Hello. Yeah. Hello. Thank you. Am I audible? 49:05 49 minutes, 5 seconds Yeah. Yes, you are. 49:07 49 minutes, 7 seconds Yeah. So, in continuation to LTV on an average what's our gold loan LTV today and what what uh LTV range we consider 49:16 49 minutes, 16 seconds comfortable from a risk management perspective. So our today our gold lov is uh 57%. 49:25 49 minutes, 25 seconds The average gold loan in our books. Yeah. 50 s. 49:29 49 minutes, 29 seconds Okay. And what range do we consider comfortable? 49:34 49 minutes, 34 seconds Range comfortable higher end or lower end on a higher end. I mean no RB regulations allow up to 84%. No. 49:42 49 minutes, 42 seconds Yeah. But from a risk risk management I mean we don't see much risk in giving at 85% currently. Yeah. 49:52 49 minutes, 52 seconds Okay. Historically how much high we have given on an average for last 10 years it is up 75% no right now we allows up to 85%. 50:03 50 minutes, 3 seconds Okay. Okay. Got it. Yeah. Thank you. 50:06 50 minutes, 6 seconds Thank you. The next question is from Rakkesh Kumar for from volunteers. Please go ahead Mr. Rakkesh. 50:15 50 minutes, 15 seconds Hello. Hello. Yes. Yes. 50:19 50 minutes, 19 seconds Yeah. Hi sir. Uh so just uh just a small question. So if you see loan amum per uh 50:27 50 minutes, 27 seconds loan account uh with reference to the slide number 19 50:34 50 minutes, 34 seconds uh the number has gone up for mut finance as well as for mut money 50:42 50 minutes, 42 seconds um by around 49 48 49% year on year. 50:47 50 minutes, 47 seconds So is it that you know is that rise is due to the you know that customer borrower appetite uh just because of you 50:55 50 minutes, 55 seconds know the gold loan price has gone up and so what is the basic reason for such a uh you know s price in the loan amum per 51:05 51 minutes, 5 seconds loan account if you look at the same similar account similar statistics for any NBSC it will 51:13 51 minutes, 13 seconds be the same because the loads are given for very short period Even every 3 months to 4 months the loan gets turned and new loans are priced at the new LTV. 51:24 51 minutes, 24 seconds So somebody who had taken 50 one lakh rupee last year when he comes after one year for a one lakh rupee instead of 10 51:31 51 minutes, 31 seconds g he need to give only five grams because the price has gone up. So definitely the gram will be lesser and 51:39 51 minutes, 39 seconds the LTV also will be higher not LTV the loan amount will be higher. 51:45 51 minutes, 45 seconds So small customers the uh people take tend to take more loans also. 51:52 51 minutes, 52 seconds No that's that's fine taken that since the gold price is rising so obviously he can avail higher amount of loan for the same gold quantity. 52:01 52 minutes, 1 second But why should he take that much of loan? Okay is there a need basically? 52:07 52 minutes, 7 seconds So uh you know you answered it you know see what happens is mut money is a new company. What happens is you know you are adding more and more new customers. 52:16 52 minutes, 16 seconds So know number of customers has increased from 2 lakh 74 to 4 lakh 68. 52:21 52 minutes, 21 seconds Now a lot of these new customers were looking at a higher ticket size customers. No. So Mut Finance has know 52:28 52 minutes, 28 seconds if you look at more than three lakh ticket size customers we have 30 know 32% of the total book. So you know so as 52:38 52 minutes, 38 seconds and when the company uh increases its footprint as well as attracts more and more customers people from higher ticket 52:45 52 minutes, 45 seconds size also might come in. So which which know elevates the average ticket size number but ultimately why should 52:52 52 minutes, 52 seconds somebody pledge gold jewelry know with a 25% margin uh know he has a requirement. 52:59 52 minutes, 59 seconds So finally this business is driven by his working capital funding requirement. 53:04 53 minutes, 4 seconds So if he has a need he will take a higher ticket size loan. Somebody who has a know lower need he will take a lower loan. 53:10 53 minutes, 10 seconds Why is he taking a loan? It is up to him because anyway he has to repay the loan. 53:15 53 minutes, 15 seconds If he takes one lakh he has to repay one lakh plus interest. He's take only 50,000 you see. So there is a need for him that is why he's borrowing otherwise why should he borrow. 53:23 53 minutes, 23 seconds See basically this business you are dealing with large number of customers with varied needs from different uh funding requirements. So know that's why 53:32 53 minutes, 32 seconds you see all these numbers. So it's very difficult for us us also to explain it at a granular level but know this 53:39 53 minutes, 39 seconds requirement is large know which elevates the ticket price. 53:44 53 minutes, 44 seconds Got it. So but like you know uh like you know setting aside Muth money if you look at mut finance also the similar thing is happening there also the growth 53:52 53 minutes, 52 seconds is around 48 48% yearon year. Yeah, average ticket size has been growing up over the last five 10 years maybe five 54:02 54 minutes, 2 seconds years back average ticket size was 15,000 then it became 25,000 then it became 30,000 then it became today I don't know how much I think it is one 54:10 54 minutes, 10 seconds lakh maybe one lakh 30,000 1 lakh 1.5 lakhs it has increased to 1.5 lakhs from one lakh so basically you you would 54:18 54 minutes, 18 seconds also be trying to assess that you know what is the what they are doing doing with the loan amount you would have also kind looked into it 54:27 54 minutes, 27 seconds what he asked them. So know they say that no somebody some people will say that no they have for business requirement etc. So know the new 54:36 54 minutes, 36 seconds guidelines kicking in and know there is some assessment about you know his income etc. But beyond that you know 54:44 54 minutes, 44 seconds customer may not cooperate know customer may say that know he's using it for business purposes etc. Got it. 54:51 54 minutes, 51 seconds Yeah. At the end of the day because he has to pledge jewelry you know only if he has a need he will pledge otherwise why should he know part with a margin of 54:59 54 minutes, 59 seconds 24% and pledge his jewelry margin of 50%. 55:02 55 minutes, 2 seconds Yeah if you include the baking charges know the borrower is parting with almost like 40 50% of the value of the jewelry. 55:11 55 minutes, 11 seconds Look considering the inflation rise or considering the credit growth in the system entire system in the entire lending ecosystem. If this kind of a 55:19 55 minutes, 19 seconds growth is there per uh per customer or per loan account uh that looks very surprising. 55:26 55 minutes, 26 seconds So see people are not using this money for making an investment or know these are all called know working capital requirement. know see money lending 55:34 55 minutes, 34 seconds activity you know is short-term you know somebody has a short-term requirement he is taking that funding you know either you can borrow from your friend or your 55:41 55 minutes, 41 seconds relatives or you can pledge with the jewelry you know after know two weeks he'll repay it which is why we are talking about the churn in the portfolio 55:51 55 minutes, 51 seconds got it got it so he might be rotating also this like you know see today know somebody coming and taking a loan two 55:59 55 minutes, 59 seconds weeks later he will close it then he might come after maybe 1 month. True. True. See you sir. 56:06 56 minutes, 6 seconds Got it. Thank you. Thank you. 56:10 56 minutes, 10 seconds Thank you ladies and gentlemen. We will take this as a last question. I now hand the conference over to management for closing comments. 56:19 56 minutes, 19 seconds Okay. Uh here from the management side very happy that uh we have had lot of uh 56:26 56 minutes, 26 seconds queries and questions and uh probably we hope that we have answered your question. We are always grateful to the 56:33 56 minutes, 33 seconds uh investor community as well as to the analysts who actually get clarifications from us. It 56:42 56 minutes, 42 seconds keeps us also uh well uh maybe on our toes and from the management side as a 56:48 56 minutes, 48 seconds company we would like to grow the book grow the company better give better results which will help customers to get 56:57 56 minutes, 57 seconds more money for their for their needs for the uh uh for the investors to get more 57:03 57 minutes, 3 seconds returns and uh maybe for the company and the staff also to do well. So with all your cooperation with all your support 57:11 57 minutes, 11 seconds we assure you that going forward also mut finance will put in all efforts at the top management up to the uh lowest 57:21 57 minutes, 21 seconds level to see that the interest of all our stakeholders are well taken care of. 57:26 57 minutes, 26 seconds So with that uh thanking all of you and also the people who participated from here for a uh for a what should I say a 57:35 57 minutes, 35 seconds very uh enriching conversation. Thank you and goodbye. 57:41 57 minutes, 41 seconds Thank you on behalf of Dam Capital Advisor. That concludes this conference. 57:45 57 minutes, 45 seconds Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.