Indigo Paints Ltd — Q3 FY26

Indigo Paints Ltd Q3 FY2025-26 Earnings Conference Call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQPulsCif20 Published: 2 months ago

0:01 1 second Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Indigo Pain's Q3 FI26 earnings conference call hosted by ICIC 0:08 8 seconds Securities Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listenon mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions 0:15 15 seconds after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on 0:22 22 seconds your stone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Aner Jooshi 0:29 29 seconds from ICICIC Securities Limited. Thank you and over to you sir. 0:34 34 seconds Yeah. Uh thanks Shubam. On behalf of ICICI securities we welcome you all to Q3 FI26 and 9 months FI26 reserves 0:43 43 seconds conference call of Indigo Paints Limited. And now now I hand over the call to Mr. Shrihari Santaumar general 0:50 50 seconds manager finance and investor relations to introduce the senior management and take the call forward. Thanks and over to sir. 0:59 59 seconds Thanks Harut. Good morning everyone and thanks for joining our investor call today to discuss the our quarterly performance as well as the 9 months ending December. 1:09 1 minute, 9 seconds Today for discussion of the results we have with us Mr. Hmon Jalan chair managing chairman and managing director of the company Mr. Chetan Humani the CFO 1:19 1 minute, 19 seconds and myself. We'll be taking the queries a Q&A session as well as the any other queries we have. We have uploaded the investor presentation in the exchanges of the in the stock exchange portals. 1:30 1 minute, 30 seconds Please go through the disclaimer se section as well. 1:34 1 minute, 34 seconds We'll start with the overview of the results. Over to you sir. Thanks Sherry. 1:41 1 minute, 41 seconds Uh morning everyone and thank you for joining us to discuss Indigo Paint's performance during the third quarter of FY26. 1:50 1 minute, 50 seconds Uh we have uploaded the investor presentations on the stock exchange portals and hopefully you've had a chance to review our financial results. 2:00 2 minutes Now we are delighted to report sustained and resilient growth for Indigo Paints in Q3 FY26 2:09 2 minutes, 9 seconds even amidst a temporary setback in the month of October which was triggered by delayed withdrawal of monsoons and an 2:17 2 minutes, 17 seconds early Diwali festival which together compressed the typical sales window. 2:25 2 minutes, 25 seconds This October softness notwithstanding, our team delivered impressive doubledigit growth in both November and 2:33 2 minutes, 33 seconds December, which more than offset the early quarter headwinds and propelled us to a respectable overall topline performance for the period. 2:45 2 minutes, 45 seconds Uh what truly stands out is the expansion in our profitability. 2:49 2 minutes, 49 seconds Uh both our EITA and PAT numbers grew at a significantly faster pace than revenue growth, 2:57 2 minutes, 57 seconds powered by a favorable product mix that emphasized premium offerings alongside 3:05 3 minutes, 5 seconds uh rigorous cost management initiatives that optimized operational efficiencies across the board. 3:14 3 minutes, 14 seconds First let me come to the standalone results. 3:17 3 minutes, 17 seconds Our standalone revenue from operations for Q3 FY26 was 338.9 crores which is a Y-on Y growth of 3.5%. 3:30 3 minutes, 30 seconds We sustained our leadership position and gross margins which stood at 47.1%. 3:37 3 minutes, 37 seconds Our EITA margin significantly improved from 17.5% 3:43 3 minutes, 43 seconds in Q3 of last year to 19.4% in Q3 of this fiscal 3:51 3 minutes, 51 seconds with an absolute EITA at rupees 65.6 crores which was 14.5% higher on a Yony basis. 4:02 4 minutes, 2 seconds During the quarter, a one-time expense of rupees 5.85 crores was booked to 4:10 4 minutes, 10 seconds provision for the impact on graduity consequent to the draft labor code on wages notified by the government. 4:19 4 minutes, 19 seconds The PAT including this exceptional item was down was 36.16 crores. But to enable 4:28 4 minutes, 28 seconds an appletoapple comparison, we have excluded the effect of this one-time expense in our investor presentations. 4:37 4 minutes, 37 seconds And for the rest of today's discussion, we will refer to PAT excluding this exceptional item. 4:45 4 minutes, 45 seconds Thus for Q3 of FY26 after excluding the effect of the exceptional item PAT stood at rupees 4:55 4 minutes, 55 seconds 40.5 crores with a PAT margin of 11.8% up from 11.0% 5:04 5 minutes, 4 seconds in Q3 of FY25 reflecting an 11.2% growth in absolute terms compared to the same period last year. 5:16 5 minutes, 16 seconds On a 9-month basis on standalone, we recorded 90 932.2 5:22 5 minutes, 22 seconds crores in revenue, which is a 2.4% Y-ONY growth with an AITA margin of 16.6% 5:32 5 minutes, 32 seconds and a PAT margin of 9.8% maintaining healthy profitability. 5:39 5 minutes, 39 seconds On absolute terms, during the 9 months, we clocked an AITA of 155 crores, which 5:45 5 minutes, 45 seconds was a 6.4% growth over the same 9 months of the last fiscal, and a PAT of 92.4 5:54 5 minutes, 54 seconds crores, which was a 6.2% growth over the same period last year. 6:01 6 minutes, 1 second Now coming to our consolidated results for the quarter. Our consolidated 6:07 6 minutes, 7 seconds revenues were 358.8 crores which is a 4.7% Y on Y growth 6:16 6 minutes, 16 seconds with an AITA margin of 19% and a PAT margin excluding exceptional items of 11.5%. 6:25 6 minutes, 25 seconds On an absolute basis, EITA grew significantly by 19.5% to rupees 68.3 6:33 6 minutes, 33 seconds crores and PAT grew by a healthy 16.4% to rupees 41.7 crores. 6:41 6 minutes, 41 seconds Our subsidiary Apple Chem delivered stellar growth and solid profitability during the quarter. 6:49 6 minutes, 49 seconds Apple Chem recorded Q3 revenues of rupees 20 crores which was a 31.5% 6:56 6 minutes, 56 seconds increase from their revenue in Q3 of last fiscal. 7:02 7 minutes, 2 seconds Gross margins for Apple Chem improved notably backed by a favorable product mix. Apple Chem has also commenced 7:12 7 minutes, 12 seconds production in its new sealant plant at Nagpur and we expect strong growth in Q4 as well from our subsidiary. 7:21 7 minutes, 21 seconds We are also actively pursuing export opportunities for Apple Chem 7:29 7 minutes, 29 seconds 9 months on a consolidated basis Indigo Paints achieved revenue of 979.9 7:37 7 minutes, 37 seconds crores which is a 2.8% 8% growth over 9 months of FY25. 7:44 7 minutes, 44 seconds EITA grew by 9% to rupees 159.2 crores and PAT grew by 9.8% to rupees 93 crores. 7:55 7 minutes, 55 seconds All other numbers are detailed in our investor presentation. 8:00 8 minutes Let me now provide some operational details about the quarter going beyond the financial numbers. 8:07 8 minutes, 7 seconds Now during the last 9 months our&p spend as a percentage of revenue 8:13 8 minutes, 13 seconds has declined to 5.9% of topline compared to 7% in the same period of FY25. 8:22 8 minutes, 22 seconds We have deliberately moderated traditional advertising expenses. 8:27 8 minutes, 27 seconds Instead, we are ramping up investment in direct influencer engagements, yielding visible results through an improved product mix. 8:39 8 minutes, 39 seconds We are also steadily expanding our Indigo color canvas stores, which is our exclusive paint store at select dealer 8:48 8 minutes, 48 seconds counters to showcase our full portfolio in immersive, aesthetically crafted environments. 8:56 8 minutes, 56 seconds We have also refreshed the packaging of our Indigo Protect Plus series, which is our waterproofing range, and backed it with a new advertising campaign. 9:09 9 minutes, 9 seconds In line with our past disclosure practices, we have reported volume and value growth figures for each of the 9:16 9 minutes, 16 seconds four major paint product categories in our investor presentations. 9:22 9 minutes, 22 seconds During Q3 of FY26, enamels and wood coatings led with a strong 18.9% 9:30 9 minutes, 30 seconds value growth and 20.2% volume growth. 9:36 9 minutes, 36 seconds This was followed by the category of primers, distempers and others which registered a 12% value growth and a 7.4% volume growth. 9:48 9 minutes, 48 seconds While the putty and cement paint category grew by 5.5% in value and 2.1% in volume. 9:58 9 minutes, 58 seconds The fourth category which is emulsions showed a modest 0.2% value growth and a slight 3.4% volume dip. 10:10 10 minutes, 10 seconds However, in emulsions, we continue to see good growth in the premium end of the emulsions, which is why value growth outpaces volume growth. 10:21 10 minutes, 21 seconds This premium mix resilience contrasts with downtrading trends reported by the industry 10:30 10 minutes, 30 seconds where peers have often seen value growth lagging the volume growth which is a trend which has not been noticed by us in any quarter. 10:41 10 minutes, 41 seconds Our waterproofing products continue to grow at a phenomenal rate and now account for close to 7% of our top line. 10:51 10 minutes, 51 seconds We continue to focus on expanding our dealer network, enhancing throughput per active dealer, and increasing the number of tinting 10:59 10 minutes, 59 seconds machines across our network. And as on 30 31st December 2025, we had over 11:06 11 minutes, 6 seconds 19,100 active dealers, more than 11,900 tinting machines. 11:13 11 minutes, 13 seconds And during the quarter, we have opened one more dep depot in the state of Uttar Pradesh, notably at Priyagar to enhance 11:21 11 minutes, 21 seconds service efficiency, taking our overall depo count to 55. 11:27 11 minutes, 27 seconds On the capex front, production has commenced at our new solventbased plant in Japur, 11:35 11 minutes, 35 seconds enabling us to better serve enamel demand in the northern and eastern regions of the country which were previously catered from the Tamil Nadu facility. 11:46 11 minutes, 46 seconds We have also started output output from our brownfield puty plant expansion at Jodpur. 11:54 11 minutes, 54 seconds What remains is the new water-based plant at Jodpur with an capacity of 90,000 kil peranom which is now expected 12:02 12 minutes, 2 seconds to start production sometime in June 2026. 12:07 12 minutes, 7 seconds Despite the delay in implementation schedule, we have enough capacity to meet demands for water-based paint products as of now. 12:17 12 minutes, 17 seconds Under our ESG framework, we remain dedicated to advancing sustainable practices and deepening community ties. 12:28 12 minutes, 28 seconds Key efforts include accelerating renewable energy adoption, highlighted by the recent commissioning 12:35 12 minutes, 35 seconds of our 330 kilowatt solar panels at Cochen factory, now generating power since last month after regulatory 12:44 12 minutes, 44 seconds clearances and also by expanding our community impact via our Indigo SAS initiative 12:53 12 minutes, 53 seconds wherein with close collaboration with local painters and communities. We have successfully repainted and revitalized 13:02 13 minutes, 2 seconds over 200 government schools across tier 2 and tier three towns since the launch of this initiative. 13:10 13 minutes, 10 seconds On the CSR front, we are dedicated to initiatives delivering lasting social value. 13:16 13 minutes, 16 seconds Through the Pile Jalan Charitable Trust's Educare Program, we continue supporting education for over 360 underprivileged girls around Pune. 13:30 13 minutes, 30 seconds The nationwide Indigo painter health benefit program now aids more than 36,000 painter families across the 13:38 13 minutes, 38 seconds country and over 950 painting contractors have gained from our Indigo skill up training 13:47 13 minutes, 47 seconds equipping them with business development skills which go beyond traditional painting expertise. 13:56 13 minutes, 56 seconds Finally, the ind uh the Indian paint industry is exhibiting unmistakable signs of a measured recovery. 14:06 14 minutes, 6 seconds Steady progress rather than a sharp exponential rebound. 14:12 14 minutes, 12 seconds At Indigo Paints, we have successfully harnessed this improving environment, delivering consistent double-digit 14:19 14 minutes, 19 seconds growth for 3 months in a row since November 25, that is November, December, and January of 26, 14:28 14 minutes, 28 seconds outpacing broader market trends through our focus on premiumization, 14:35 14 minutes, 35 seconds operational resilience, and targeted network expansion. 14:40 14 minutes, 40 seconds Looking ahead, we are quite optimistic that this robust momentum will persist through the remaining months of FY26, 14:49 14 minutes, 49 seconds positioning us strongly for the seasonally strong Q4. 14:54 14 minutes, 54 seconds That's all I have to say in terms of my opening remarks and I look forward to answering your questions. Thank you. 15:05 15 minutes, 5 seconds Thank you very much. We will now begin with the question and answer sessions. 15:08 15 minutes, 8 seconds Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on your redstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you 15:16 15 minutes, 16 seconds may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question Q assembles. 15:27 15 minutes, 27 seconds The first question comes from the line of Praash Kapadia from Kapadia Financial Services. Please go ahead. 15:34 15 minutes, 34 seconds Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. Uh couple of questions from my end. 15:41 15 minutes, 41 seconds It's been almost two years that you know painting demand has been muted. 15:47 15 minutes, 47 seconds So any insights you could you know give in terms of consumption patterns changing because you know people seem to 15:55 15 minutes, 55 seconds be traveling, people seem to be you know buying cars and you know this is you know contradictory at a time when you know real estate 16:03 16 minutes, 3 seconds sales were pretty buoyant after COVID and even if you consider a four five year cycle rental markets have been strong. So why is you know the pain 16:12 16 minutes, 12 seconds demand still you know not seeing recovery as anticipated. Any thoughts on that will be helpful. 16:22 16 minutes, 22 seconds Uh so you mentioned about people buying cars. Now notice that people were not buying very many cars until the GST cut 16:30 16 minutes, 30 seconds happened very recently and that has led to a big spurt in automobile purchase during the last 3 4 months. Now uh 16:39 16 minutes, 39 seconds unfortunately paint sector has not benefited from any GST cut and I don't think we are expecting any but uh your 16:47 16 minutes, 47 seconds comment about real estate going up see new construction accounts for a very small part of paint purchase. 16:54 16 minutes, 54 seconds So uh the major is repainting that happens. Now why there has been a demand 17:01 17 minutes, 1 second slump and the demand slump was not just in the paint sector. It was across all 17:07 17 minutes, 7 seconds categories in consumer products and I think the government was sufficiently alarmed with that trend for the last one 17:15 17 minutes, 15 seconds and a half two years that it undertook several steps starting from the last year's budget when a huge income tax 17:23 17 minutes, 23 seconds relief was given to the middle class which was followed by I think three rounds of uh or maybe four rounds of uh 17:31 17 minutes, 31 seconds reduction in interest rates by RBI and finally the GST cut which did not impact paint but overall as far as the overall 17:39 17 minutes, 39 seconds consumer basket is concerned it provided a lot of relief to the middleman uh to the common man and thereafter you see 17:48 17 minutes, 48 seconds that all consumer companies are reporting an uptick in demand. I think the paint industry is also witnessing a 17:56 17 minutes, 56 seconds revival of demand. Unfortunately, since paint demand is impacted by weather, which is not the true for soaps, 18:04 18 minutes, 4 seconds shampoos, biscuits and other things that October was expectedly a bad month because last year oc you know Diwali 18:13 18 minutes, 13 seconds came I'm talking about 2024 October Diwali came and 31st of October and this time it was around the 20th of October. 18:23 18 minutes, 23 seconds So a shorter Diwali season coupled with a very delayed monsoon withdrawal uh led to a very short purchase window pre- 18:32 18 minutes, 32 seconds Diwali. So October of this year compared to October of last year was definitely bad and that seems to have dampened the 18:41 18 minutes, 41 seconds results at least for us and my guess is for the entire paint industry. However, from what I hear in the market, everyone 18:50 18 minutes, 50 seconds seems to be doing well in the last 3 months relative to the past. Now, it's not a hockey stick recovery, but there 18:57 18 minutes, 57 seconds is a very perceptible change and for us after 2 years, this is the first time when for 3 months in a row, November, 19:04 19 minutes, 4 seconds December and January, we are seeing double-digit growth in value. I'm talking only value. I'm not talking 19:11 19 minutes, 11 seconds volume, which I think is irrelevant. So hopefully hopefully fingers crossed uh 19:18 19 minutes, 18 seconds this maintains itself in the coming months and if that happens I'm sure you'll see significantly better results 19:27 19 minutes, 27 seconds definitely from Indigo and my guess is from the entire paint industry also as far as Q4 and going into FY27 is concerned. 19:38 19 minutes, 38 seconds Understood. And any sense you could give in terms of you know the product mix now versus earlier contribution of imulsials 19:46 19 minutes, 46 seconds enamels value added products versus few years ago because you know we are trying to premiumize the portfolio and that end 19:53 19 minutes, 53 seconds we are doing relatively better any any sense you would have in terms of contribution now versus earlier 20:01 20 minutes, 1 second I can talk about ourselves so for ourselves the share of the premium end of emulsions has been significantly rising contain continuously for the last 20:10 20 minutes, 10 seconds 2 years and that includes the demand slowdown period. The premium end of emulsions continued to do well for us 20:18 20 minutes, 18 seconds and kept registering good value growth even during the worst of times. 20:23 20 minutes, 23 seconds uh during the last one year the segment of enamels has done quite well and we have specifically focused on that 20:31 20 minutes, 31 seconds because it's a fairly large category and we have a differentiated offering there by way of PU enamel and uh we are kind 20:40 20 minutes, 40 seconds of known as the PU enamel company others have tried to imitate perhaps not with as much success so enamels are giving us 20:48 20 minutes, 48 seconds a big boost waterproofing segment is giving a very good boost What has not fared well for us in the 20:56 20 minutes, 56 seconds last 9 months has been the economy range of the emulsions. So we have made corrections and in January we registered 21:05 21 minutes, 5 seconds our highest ever growths and the highest ever sales figures for economy range emulsions. 21:12 21 minutes, 12 seconds So it's just a question of retargeting your focus in terms of trade discounts 21:18 21 minutes, 18 seconds and influencer engagements and we intend to go after that sector pretty strongly 21:24 21 minutes, 24 seconds because uh it's a very large segment and unfortunately we had not done very well 21:31 21 minutes, 31 seconds for that in the first 9 months but uh you know if you talk in terms of macro in the last 2 three years the 21:38 21 minutes, 38 seconds waterproofing which was zero for us two years ago is now accounting for about 7% of our top line. 21:47 21 minutes, 47 seconds Uh enamels, puty etc. have more or less maintained their share. There has been a 21:56 21 minutes, 56 seconds readjustment in emulsions that the share of premium emulsions have gone up and economy emulsions have come down a 22:04 22 minutes, 4 seconds little bit. That's that's the broad change that I can talk about in our product mix. Sure, 22:12 22 minutes, 12 seconds understood. Thank you. I'll join back if I have more questions and hoping to have a great Q4 and FY27. Thank you. 22:20 22 minutes, 20 seconds Thank you, Praashi. 22:23 22 minutes, 23 seconds Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Aish Roy from Dwarmama. Please go ahead. 22:29 22 minutes, 29 seconds Yeah, thanks. My question is on the advertising spend. Uh last 3 years you have saved almost 400 bits in terms of 22:36 22 minutes, 36 seconds A&P to sales ratio uh at 5.8. at 87 in the last 9 months. Now you're pretty close to the larger players which are 22:44 22 minutes, 44 seconds broadly four to 5% of their sales goes to advertising. So are you now almost at the at the end of uh this cost 22:52 22 minutes, 52 seconds savings. Second is if you could comment on how the advertising spent by the number two number three legacy player 22:59 22 minutes, 59 seconds and the new players are given overall competitive intensity change which has happened. That is my first question. 23:07 23 minutes, 7 seconds So on advertising of niche uh there has been a drop as a percentage but not as significantly a drop in 23:16 23 minutes, 16 seconds absolute terms in terms of our advertising. 23:19 23 minutes, 19 seconds Now it drops as a percentage if you maintain your ATL advertising at a constant absolute level and your 23:26 23 minutes, 26 seconds turnover keeps increasing which it has significantly in the last four years. So that brings a natural drop in 23:34 23 minutes, 34 seconds advertising expense as a percentage of revenue. If you talk about where we are in terms of total advertising spends uh 23:43 23 minutes, 43 seconds we are certainly lower in advertising compared to the market leader Asian paints and uh the new entrant bila opus 23:51 23 minutes, 51 seconds both of whom spend a huge amount of advertising. 23:55 23 minutes, 55 seconds We are somewhat lower than the number two player in terms of BGER. But when we see our advertising TV ad spends which 24:04 24 minutes, 4 seconds is what we can track objectively I think we are significantly higher than the uh number three number four player that is 24:13 24 minutes, 13 seconds both Nolac and Axo and also from the other smaller players like JSW or Nippon 24:21 24 minutes, 21 seconds who have drastically reduced their advertising spends. So uh I think on an 24:27 24 minutes, 27 seconds absolute amount uh we are fairly good. I mean I would say that after Asian Baopus 24:36 24 minutes, 36 seconds and uh Burgger we are the next largest advertiser on television and uh I think 24:44 24 minutes, 44 seconds that that is where we intend to stay. We have built a brand with consistent advertising at an elevated level for 24:52 24 minutes, 52 seconds over 13 14 years now. I think the brand is sufficiently well known and we 25:00 25 minutes maintain a constant level of advertising for at least 9 10 months in a year excluding a couple of months during the 25:07 25 minutes, 7 seconds monsoon. So I think the brand recognition stays, the brand awareness is there and in paint line as opposed to 25:17 25 minutes, 17 seconds certain FMCG all you need is back of the mind brand recall and you need to focus 25:24 25 minutes, 24 seconds much more on influencer engagement so that they recommend your brand to the consumer 25:31 25 minutes, 31 seconds much more and that is where our focus and spends are now directed in a much higher proportion. Sure. 25:40 25 minutes, 40 seconds Sure. Thanks. My second question is on dealer incentive, dealer promotions and overall intensity. Uh in in October 25:49 25 minutes, 49 seconds clearly the entire industry saw weaker than the initial expectation and my sense is maybe in November December there was a higher discounting to uh 25:57 25 minutes, 57 seconds adjust on the higher inventory in the market. uh and you also said that in the imulsion 26:04 26 minutes, 4 seconds uh you plan to now uh become more uh uh on the more attuned to the market in 26:11 26 minutes, 11 seconds terms of uh the the influencer and the dealer discount. So I wanted to understand uh how is the overall intensity? Yes, last 3 months there is a 26:20 26 minutes, 20 seconds recovery for you and the industry but is it only on the volume is it also on the sales side because for the number two 26:26 26 minutes, 26 seconds legacy flare we did say see that the gap between volume and sales was on the on the higher side this time versus initial expectation and their own legacy. If you 26:35 26 minutes, 35 seconds could comment on net discounting net pricing how is the current situation? 26:41 26 minutes, 41 seconds So Anish we have always disclosed very granularly our value and volume growth across all segments and not just in this 26:50 26 minutes, 50 seconds quarter even for the preceding quarters if you take out our disclosures you'll find that there is hardly any gap between the value and the volume numbers 26:58 26 minutes, 58 seconds at most one percentage point here and there now and then and in most cases the value growth leads the volume growth 27:06 27 minutes, 6 seconds rather than the other way around for the other people. So why is the volume growth much higher for other players compared to their value growth is a 27:15 27 minutes, 15 seconds question that you have to answer them is a a question that you have to ask uh from them because there's been no noticeable price change in the industry. 27:24 27 minutes, 24 seconds So I really don't understand as to why value and volume growth should be significantly different from each other. 27:31 27 minutes, 31 seconds Now over the last year as raw material prices have softened uh people have resorted or passed it on 27:39 27 minutes, 39 seconds because rather than taking a price cut the industry has kind of passed on higher discounts to the trade and that 27:46 27 minutes, 46 seconds is something that naturally happens and that continues to happen uh in for us also. we find that increasingly 27:55 27 minutes, 55 seconds you know the discount compared to the same month of last year is slightly higher and despite that the gross 28:03 28 minutes, 3 seconds margins maintain as to where they were I mean in Q3 of last year our gross margin was 47.2 2 and this time it is 47.1. 28:13 28 minutes, 13 seconds So it's hardly any noticeable change. 28:16 28 minutes, 16 seconds Now having said that you know we we have been saying for the last 5 years that our gross margin are the highest in the 28:23 28 minutes, 23 seconds paint industry and they have been consistently the highest without exception of even a single quarter for the last 5 years. Now on one side that 28:33 28 minutes, 33 seconds is heartwarming on the other side it is perhaps a missed opportunity. 28:39 28 minutes, 39 seconds Why should we not think of going even more aggressively on trade discounts and 28:46 28 minutes, 46 seconds uh maybe sacrifice a percentage point from our gross margin will still be the highest but if sales can grow 28:53 28 minutes, 53 seconds disproportionately higher then our EITA margins will not be impacted they will in fact rise. 29:00 29 minutes So that is the thinking going forward that uh let us treat this exceptionally high 29:07 29 minutes, 7 seconds gross margin as an opportunity that we leverage properly in the market and try 29:14 29 minutes, 14 seconds and get a disproportionately higher sales growth because we definitely have room for it uh in our gross margins to 29:22 29 minutes, 22 seconds do that. And uh we have tried that in the last couple of months and uh it has worked very well 29:29 29 minutes, 29 seconds and we intend to continue doing that going forward. Uh and I'm I'm I'm quite hopeful that it'll yield uh the desired results. 29:40 29 minutes, 40 seconds Understood. Uh last quick question. Uh your active dealer count went down after Q2 FI25 for two quarters and then 29:48 29 minutes, 48 seconds started going up. So if you could tell us what was the reason that point of time and is that correction done? So you 29:55 29 minutes, 55 seconds are now again expanding but is that activity done in terms of correction? I don't think the active dealer count actually went down. Maybe it was kind of 30:05 30 minutes, 5 seconds stagnant. I have uh we have given the dealer count. Okay. There was in Q4 the 30:12 30 minutes, 12 seconds in Q4 of last year is is the only time when I can see a dip in the dealer count happening. 30:20 30 minutes, 20 seconds Q3 and Q4. Uh yeah, Q3 very minor by maybe 100. 30:25 30 minutes, 25 seconds Yes, you're right. I'm I'm now seeing the slide presentation that we have done. So frankly speaking, 30:33 30 minutes, 33 seconds the dealer count is not something that drives us very much. What we are looking at is throughput per dealer. with the 30:40 30 minutes, 40 seconds active dealer count that we have which is only slightly less than let's say the number three player we we technically 30:49 30 minutes, 49 seconds could be doing two and a half times the sales that we are doing. So what we really need to pull up is the throughput 30:57 30 minutes, 57 seconds per dealer. So I think a population around 19,000 active dealers is good 31:03 31 minutes, 3 seconds enough and that 19,000 organically may inch up to maybe 20,000 in the course of 31:11 31 minutes, 11 seconds a year but that is not what is going to give us our desired growth. We need to get 50% more out of the dealers that we 31:21 31 minutes, 21 seconds have to get our real growth and that is what is important for us and therefore the tinting machine count which is a 31:30 31 minutes, 30 seconds little more relevant. You'll find that the tinting machine population has been growing much much faster than our dealer 31:37 31 minutes, 37 seconds count. I mean in in the last uh one and a half years a our dealer count may have 31:43 31 minutes, 43 seconds grown by maybe a thousand but our tinting machine count has grown by 2,000. So the percentage of our dealers 31:52 31 minutes, 52 seconds having tinting machines is now significantly higher than what they were a year ago or much much higher than what 31:59 31 minutes, 59 seconds they were four years ago. So that is what really leads to a dealer increasing his throughput with us. So although we 32:08 32 minutes, 8 seconds keep track of this active dealer count, I don't think we are overtly motivated by increasing that in a very significant 32:16 32 minutes, 16 seconds way. That will inch up on its own in a small way as we go forward. 32:29 32 minutes, 29 seconds Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Rohit Ranjan from KL Securities. Please go ahead. 32:36 32 minutes, 36 seconds Yeah. Uh good morning sir. 32:38 32 minutes, 38 seconds I have just one question uh that is related to the jotur plant coming live very soon 32:47 32 minutes, 47 seconds and uh that capacity has to get consumed at some point of time. So how exactly are we going to increase our market 32:56 32 minutes, 56 seconds share with currently being at around 2 to 3%. And with the J food plant coming online are we are we going to increase 33:04 33 minutes, 4 seconds the throughput so that we coming back to around you know the 25 30% margin. I remember growth projection that was given was 33:13 33 minutes, 13 seconds that okay the industry flares if they are growing at around you know middle middle single digits then we will be able to reach 25 to 30%. It's been two 33:22 33 minutes, 22 seconds years we have marked in the light of the day for that. with this Jotu plant coming in it is going to hit our fat 33:30 33 minutes, 30 seconds margin uh because uh your depreciation will come into play. So unless and until we see a good topline growth with a good 33:38 33 minutes, 38 seconds jump in net profit are we still going to be seeing uh you know a similar pattern what we have seen in the last two years 33:46 33 minutes, 46 seconds or the management thinking really pushing and gaining market share uh you know by taking other dealers or 33:53 33 minutes, 53 seconds increasing throughput. If we can have some realistic and a very aggressive target around this, how exactly you going to change the situation or are we going to depending upon the low demand 34:02 34 minutes, 2 seconds which is going on you know up and down all the time. 34:06 34 minutes, 6 seconds So Roh G in this industry capacity and sales are not necessarily 34:13 34 minutes, 13 seconds correlated. I mean having more capacity does not necessarily result in higher sales. 34:20 34 minutes, 20 seconds So capacity expansion and modernization and automation is a continuous process that you indulge in for the long term. 34:31 34 minutes, 31 seconds Now this this expansion at the Jpur plant was undertaken 3 years ago when 34:37 34 minutes, 37 seconds the demand scenario was very good and when we were growing at more than 20% peranom now in between for 2 years there 34:47 34 minutes, 47 seconds has been a slump in demand across the sector that does not mean that you hold back or uh you know go slow on your 34:54 34 minutes, 54 seconds capacity expansion because sooner or later you know that this demand will come back and this capacity expansion is 35:01 35 minutes, 1 second for the next 5 6 years put together. So you are right that once this plant comes on stream there is a slightly added 35:10 35 minutes, 10 seconds depreciation load which definitely starts affecting PAT in some way. It won't affect EITA but it will affect uh 35:18 35 minutes, 18 seconds PAT but uh hopefully with the tailwinds that we are seeing in the last 3 months 35:26 35 minutes, 26 seconds as I said we are hopeful of being close to doubledigit growth in Q4 and uh if 35:33 35 minutes, 33 seconds the demand comes back properly we should go back to our 20% growth sometime next fiscal of course that is all presuming 35:41 35 minutes, 41 seconds and keeping fingers crossed that the overall industry demand demand comes back robustly. So we have to wait and watch for that. 35:50 35 minutes, 50 seconds But a capacity, it was not only a capacity expansion at JPUR, it was a significant modernization. 35:58 35 minutes, 58 seconds This was a legacy plant that was set up originally in 2006. 36:03 36 minutes, 3 seconds You know, when our annual turnover was uh less than 10 crores and incrementally over time we have grown by just adding 36:11 36 minutes, 11 seconds more machinery. But after 20 years of growing and reaching a level of operation which was you know 30x of what 36:20 36 minutes, 20 seconds we were when the original plant was set up, it was time to completely modernize and automate the plant to cater to the 36:30 36 minutes, 30 seconds scale at which we were operating. And that is something that we have done along with of course an expansion in the 36:36 36 minutes, 36 seconds capacity and this will bring our significant capex uh to an end for the 36:43 36 minutes, 43 seconds next foreseeable four five years. This will carry us through till maybe FY29. 36:50 36 minutes, 50 seconds So there will be a temporary drip dip in some ratios like return on capital employed and uh all that but uh that 36:59 36 minutes, 59 seconds will uh recover itself in the next uh couple of years and uh as far as operation is concerned it is linked to 37:08 37 minutes, 8 seconds demand in the market and what we can get and not so much related to the capacity that we have built up. 37:15 37 minutes, 15 seconds So imag your B2B kind of business working 37:23 37 minutes, 23 seconds directly with you know the uh infrastructure related kind of development which is going on with it presence being mostly in Maharashtra and 37:31 37 minutes, 31 seconds you know the Mumbai 3.0 to and you know the various port related developments which are going on huge investment in infrastructure being planned uh I mean 37:40 37 minutes, 40 seconds aren't we kind of wanting to double up on you know getting a good amount of revenue because there's huge amount of pie out there uh can 37:48 37 minutes, 48 seconds you're absolutely right on that yeah so they have as I said they have grown by 31% or 31.5% in this quarter 37:57 37 minutes, 57 seconds compared to the same quarter last year so they are getting the benefit of uh the increased infrastructure spends in 38:05 38 minutes, 5 seconds India. Yes, a large portion of their revenue does come from Maharashtra and some nearby states like Madhya Pradesh 38:12 38 minutes, 12 seconds but it is not confined to that. They're beginning to get a significant portion of their sales from southern India from 38:20 38 minutes, 20 seconds various metro and road projects there and also from eastern India you know in Assam and Bihar and a small amount of 38:28 38 minutes, 28 seconds exports have also started. So all around I think the future of Apple Chem looks good. They have expanded their plant. 38:37 38 minutes, 37 seconds They have added new product lines for self-manufacture which they were getting it jobworked earlier in a small way 38:46 38 minutes, 46 seconds which are the sealants and uh other adhesives and uh I think it the company has a 38:54 38 minutes, 54 seconds bright future and it's it's going along quite well. 38:59 38 minutes, 59 seconds Yes. And we as investors, you know, we have been patiently waiting for that, you know, those days where we're going to come back to 25 to 30%, it's been 5 39:07 39 minutes, 7 seconds years. Hopefully, we can turn the, you know, the the entire situation upside down and get back to our winning days. 39:13 39 minutes, 13 seconds Yeah. Wishing all this necessarily. Well, like you, I personally am also a very large investor in Indigo Paints and yes, it is 39:22 39 minutes, 22 seconds disappointing the performance especially the last two years. Prior to that, it wasn't so bad. If you if you look at uh 39:30 39 minutes, 30 seconds you know uh two years back I mean our our growth numbers were quite healthy. 39:36 39 minutes, 36 seconds So uh yes I just like you we are also hoping that this demand turnaround 39:43 39 minutes, 43 seconds accelerates in the days ahead and uh you know we come back to good numbers. If you're talking about investment in 39:52 39 minutes, 52 seconds shares and all that then you see those get also determined by some other factors I mean during the last four five 40:00 40 minutes years if you see our profitability growth has always been very good even in the worst of times we have grown significantly on profit now 40:08 40 minutes, 8 seconds unfortunately because of the entry of a large new entrant uh the sector got 40:15 40 minutes, 15 seconds derated that various analysts uh started writing off this sector as you know a 40:23 40 minutes, 23 seconds doomsday is coming to the paint industry and uh profitability is going to be ruined etc which we were confident would 40:31 40 minutes, 31 seconds not happen. Time has borne itself out that we were right. Nobody's profitability has been impacted. 40:39 40 minutes, 39 seconds Yes, a new entrant may have taken some market share at a significant cost to itself. That is their business. But by 40:47 40 minutes, 47 seconds and large the industry dynamics, the profitability, gross margins, EITA margins have largely remained 40:55 40 minutes, 55 seconds unaffected. Unfortunately, it coincided with a downturn in the demand happening across consumer sector. So, the effect 41:02 41 minutes, 2 seconds was a little more depressing. But now that things are looking up, it's only a matter of time uh before people get back to their fancy for the paint sector. 41:14 41 minutes, 14 seconds uh and uh I think everything will get rerated in the market in the near future. 41:23 41 minutes, 23 seconds Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Bobby J from France Investment. Please go ahead. 41:31 41 minutes, 31 seconds Hello uh Mr. Jal. 41:35 41 minutes, 35 seconds Thank you. So your IPO was actually during the covid years when uh the growth was very strong because it was an 41:42 41 minutes, 42 seconds abnormal period right uh so we don't really know what a company of your size can perform during normal times and that 41:52 41 minutes, 52 seconds will be new even to you uh so uh now given that your GDP is growing at 8% there's good rainfall and that taxes are 42:01 42 minutes, 1 second being cut and everything but still we are unable to grow even a very small So uh you know what gives you the 42:08 42 minutes, 8 seconds confidence that you know these high doubledigit numbers that you talk about can be done in a normal market? I mean 42:16 42 minutes, 16 seconds what edge do you have over the bigger players like Asian Pain because whatever innovation you come up with they can come up with they have far bigger 42:23 42 minutes, 23 seconds budgets. So could you explain that thinking? What gives you the confidence to increase capacity and that you can actually grow at high growth rates? 42:33 42 minutes, 33 seconds Okay. Uh our our IPO did happen 5 years ago. If you can look at 10 years 42:41 42 minutes, 41 seconds preceding the IPO, uh our our growth or CAGGR was in the range of 30 to 40%. Of course in the 42:50 42 minutes, 50 seconds earlier days if you talk about you know 2012 or 2014 or 2015 when the base was 42:58 42 minutes, 58 seconds much lower you can say that uh it was easy to grow at 40%. I don't quite think so because no other company of our size 43:07 43 minutes, 7 seconds that time ever grew by 40%. So you have more than 2,000 companies in the paint sector of all shapes and sizes. 43:18 43 minutes, 18 seconds uh ranging from 1 cr in size to 50 crores in size to a few hundred crores and so on. I think we have outstripped 43:27 43 minutes, 27 seconds that growth over a very long period of time and at least reached the big league so to say. Now today if you say let's 43:36 43 minutes, 36 seconds not compare with Asian Paints because Asian Paints is too large a company compared to us. 43:43 43 minutes, 43 seconds uh let us compare with let's say the number four player Axon Nobel where the 43:49 43 minutes, 49 seconds decorative paint net sales is around 2200 and we are let's say at around 14,500 43:58 43 minutes, 58 seconds so I would say that we are in the same ballpark and uh a company like Kansai Narolac 44:06 44 minutes, 6 seconds which overall is a much larger company than us but its decorative paint business is somewhere of the order of 3 and a half thousand 44:13 44 minutes, 13 seconds So we are just around half of their size. So we are not that disproportionately small compared to 44:20 44 minutes, 20 seconds them. But if you compare the track record of ours versus these two companies and you can take any time 44:28 44 minutes, 28 seconds horizon that you want. Of course for these two companies which get 50% of their business from industrial paints. 44:35 44 minutes, 35 seconds you will need to get granular insights as to how the decorative paint uh portfolio has been doing and you'll find 44:43 44 minutes, 43 seconds that we have outstripped them many times over the past few years. Now bigger companies have bigger budgets of that 44:52 44 minutes, 52 seconds there is no doubt. However, the differentiated products for which we are known for which still account for 45:01 45 minutes, 1 second anywhere from 28 to 29% of our portfolio. Now these products were launched by us anywhere from 15 to 10 45:10 45 minutes, 10 seconds years ago and they have been in the market for a long time. Yes, other companies have budgets to replicate that 45:17 45 minutes, 17 seconds and they have replicated that and made repeated attempts to break into floor codes and metallic emulsions and tile 45:25 45 minutes, 25 seconds codes and RPU enamels etc. But they have not been very successful 45:32 45 minutes, 32 seconds and uh we have managed to hold on to it with uh proprietary technology 45:39 45 minutes, 39 seconds uh very targeted advertising at these niche products and maintaining our goodwill and our product spread in the 45:46 45 minutes, 46 seconds market and uh if we have done so successfully for 15 years I see no reason why we will not be able to do so 45:55 45 minutes, 55 seconds in the forthcoming years also. So even after our IPO uh 46:03 46 minutes, 3 seconds maybe the first year after our IPO was not a very great uh year for us when our growth was similar to the industry 46:10 46 minutes, 10 seconds growth but after that for the next two years we did outpace all the industry leaders as far as the growth rate was concerned. 46:20 46 minutes, 20 seconds Even in the last two years during demand slowdown we have been better but uh you know the multiples I mean if they are at 46:27 46 minutes, 27 seconds a negative level if if the market leader is doing minus2 or minus4 and if we manage to do even +2 or +4 I would 46:36 46 minutes, 36 seconds consider that that's pretty good. Uh when when there are headwinds in the market it's very difficult to grow at 46:45 46 minutes, 45 seconds 20%. When the whole industry is saddled with a very weak demand. Now as the demand comes back you will start seeing 46:53 46 minutes, 53 seconds that divergence between our growth rate and their growth rate. Our base is still a little lower than them and I think we 47:01 47 minutes, 1 second are an agile company with still a startup mindset although we are not exactly a startup and uh we are fairly 47:09 47 minutes, 9 seconds confident of holding our own as we have held for the last 25 years. 47:16 47 minutes, 16 seconds All right. Thank you. Thank you. 47:19 47 minutes, 19 seconds Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Azer Jenara from Samika Capital. Please go ahead. 47:29 47 minutes, 29 seconds Thank you for uh giving me the chance to ask the question. Most of my question was already answered. So you can skip me. 47:38 47 minutes, 38 seconds Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Dave Tagert from I thought PMS. Please go ahead. 47:47 47 minutes, 47 seconds Uh thank you for the opportunity sir. So I just wanted to understand like what is our throughut uh throughutuh ratio over 47:55 47 minutes, 55 seconds the years like between tier 1, tier 2 and tier three, tier four like how it has improved what are the plan to. 48:13 48 minutes, 13 seconds Hello sir. 48:16 48 minutes, 16 seconds Uh I'm sorry I was on mute. Uh Dj uh the problem in giving a quantitative answer 48:22 48 minutes, 22 seconds to your question is I don't quite know whether there is a formal definition of what constitutes a tier one market, what 48:31 48 minutes, 31 seconds constitutes a tier 2 market etc. There is no formal definition of that in India. And people draw their lines 48:38 48 minutes, 38 seconds between these various tiers depending upon what they think is reasonable. 48:43 48 minutes, 43 seconds Having said that, broadly speaking and the definition that we use is that the top 12 cities in India, we classify them as like a metro. 48:55 48 minutes, 55 seconds Uh for us, a a tier one town would be a town which would be in excess of maybe 49:03 49 minutes, 3 seconds 10 lakhs of population or something. A a tier two town would be something in the range of 3 to 10 lakhs or thereabouts 49:11 49 minutes, 11 seconds roughly. A tier three would be maybe 1 to three lakh population and tier four would be less than one lakh population. 49:20 49 minutes, 20 seconds And anything below 25,000 we kind of classify as rural. That's that's the kind of broad definition that we take. 49:29 49 minutes, 29 seconds Now if you look at 4 5 years ago our presence in the metros and tier 1 cities 49:35 49 minutes, 35 seconds was abysmally low. Now today that is not true. In in tier 1 and tier 2 cities we 49:43 49 minutes, 43 seconds have a very strong presence. Now in almost all the tier one tier 2 cities as far as metros are concerned there are 49:51 49 minutes, 51 seconds some metros where we have made good inroads and there are many uh metros where our presence is still abysmally low. 49:59 49 minutes, 59 seconds But overall we are moving from being a predominantly tier three tier 4 focused company 5 years ago to being a company 50:08 50 minutes, 8 seconds that has very good representation across tier 1, tier 2, tier three and tier four and we are trying to inch up further and 50:18 50 minutes, 18 seconds do better as far as the metros are concerned. 50:21 50 minutes, 21 seconds So that is a long process. It's a gradual process and it is something that happens naturally over a period of time 50:29 50 minutes, 29 seconds and uh along with that even in our product portfolio we have been consistently moving upwards in the 50:37 50 minutes, 37 seconds premium end of the paints rather than our earlier portfolio 5 seven years ago which was predominantly in the economy and the subeconomy range of products. 50:49 50 minutes, 49 seconds I hope that answers your question. 50:53 50 minutes, 53 seconds Uh yes sir thank you so much sir. Uh if possible could you also give us some index number like three four years back 51:00 51 minutes in tier one if a dealer one cr of sales how much the indigo throughput was and currently what could be theut. 51:08 51 minutes, 8 seconds So that would be very hard to pull out and very difficult to disclose at a public forum. So I can as I said you 51:17 51 minutes, 17 seconds know even giving any kind of quantitative number would first mean that you and I have to reach an agreement as to what constitutes each 51:24 51 minutes, 24 seconds tier and beyond that how much our share has increased in tier 1 or tier 2 is not a number that we'd like to publicly 51:33 51 minutes, 33 seconds disclose except to say that it has risen very very significantly. 51:41 51 minutes, 41 seconds Got it sir got it sir. No worries. Thank you sir. Thank you so much. 51:46 51 minutes, 46 seconds Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Ander Jooshi from ICA Securities. Please go ahead. 51:54 51 minutes, 54 seconds Uh yeah. Uh two questions from my side. U so we have 52:02 52 minutes, 2 seconds seen there are lot of uh different action as far as pricing is concerned. 52:08 52 minutes, 8 seconds Birus has raised prices by two to six% whereas Exonovable has cut the prices 52:14 52 minutes, 14 seconds also. So how do you see uh the pricing discipline getting maintained and how do you see the pricing actions for Indigo? 52:23 52 minutes, 23 seconds So considering the commodity prices at least we believe at this stage price hikes are not required but will there be 52:30 52 minutes, 30 seconds possibility of price cuts uh just to gain or retain the market share? That is question number one. Question number 52:38 52 minutes, 38 seconds two, in terms of the differentiated products, uh because that has been the 52:45 52 minutes, 45 seconds backbone of the company. Uh now we don't see much of an uh discussion on these uh aspects. So how do you see the 52:52 52 minutes, 52 seconds differentiated product and how they are doing any new launches or plans to new plans of launches etc. Anything if you can elaborate a bit more. Yeah. Yeah. 53:03 53 minutes, 3 seconds Thanks. So Anid you you talked about some price increase by Bira Opus. Now I 53:10 53 minutes, 10 seconds think you're all well aware that Bila Opus was uh the product that was selling at the highest level of discount and the 53:18 53 minutes, 18 seconds lowest price in the market compared to all other industry peers. So them having made a very minor price increase, I mean 53:28 53 minutes, 28 seconds their lower price was not of concern to anyone else in the industry and their increasing price small by a small 53:37 53 minutes, 37 seconds amount. They still remain the cheapest uh product available. So I don't think that matters to us or to anyone in the 53:45 53 minutes, 45 seconds paint sector. As far as AXO is concerned, you will notice that the price decrease that they have announced 53:53 53 minutes, 53 seconds are for very very few products and those were not significant selling products of AXO at all. So if those are products 54:02 54 minutes, 2 seconds that were really not selling in the market in any appreciable manner, then any price decrease or movement in that 54:09 54 minutes, 9 seconds is also not like to likely to upset the pricing Apple cart as far as the industry is concerned. 54:16 54 minutes, 16 seconds Now what will happen for the pricing going forward? It's a question that only the market leader can answer as to what is its strategy. 54:26 54 minutes, 26 seconds Now recently I've seen from the number two player in Burgger that for some products they have lowered the prices 54:34 54 minutes, 34 seconds and for some products they have increased the prices. Now uh I have no idea why that has happened and they can 54:42 54 minutes, 42 seconds answer that question. That must be a strategic call that the company has taken. Maybe for certain products they're not doing well and uh they have 54:50 54 minutes, 50 seconds chosen to drop prices and certain products they're doing very well and they have chosen to counterbalance that by increasing prices there. But normally 54:59 54 minutes, 59 seconds pricing trends in the industry are dictated by the market leader. 55:06 55 minutes, 6 seconds Now if if uh the market leader decides to either increase or reduce prices and 55:13 55 minutes, 13 seconds I don't see a trigger for either of that happening in the foreseeable future but if for reasons best known to it if it 55:20 55 minutes, 20 seconds chooses to either increase or reduce prices I think the whole industry will be forced to follow suit and whatever 55:29 55 minutes, 29 seconds impact it has will be passed on to the dealer either by reduced dealer discounts or by increased dealer 55:37 55 minutes, 37 seconds discounts depending on which way the pricing goes but I personally don't expect any significant change in the 55:45 55 minutes, 45 seconds pricing in the foreseeable future and uh therefore I think pricing and trade 55:52 55 minutes, 52 seconds discounts will kind of continue where they have been in the last couple of months. 55:58 55 minutes, 58 seconds As far as differentiated products are concerned, their overall share in our total revenue we disclose once a year 56:06 56 minutes, 6 seconds after the year is over because those products have a seasonality inside them. 56:10 56 minutes, 10 seconds And therefore to talk about it on a quarterly basis does not make very much sense and we will come back next quarter 56:18 56 minutes, 18 seconds when the year fiscal is over and tell you as to what percentage contribution comes from those differentiated 56:25 56 minutes, 25 seconds products. My guess so far is that there is no material change in the last one year and u they continue to hold their 56:34 56 minutes, 34 seconds own and account for roughly the same share of the top line as they have been in the last few years. So we are not 56:43 56 minutes, 43 seconds losing market share there. We might have gained infinite decimally. uh we will know when the year is over as to where 56:50 56 minutes, 50 seconds we are but uh we seem to be holding our own as far as those products are concerned. 56:58 56 minutes, 58 seconds Okay. Sure sir. Uh just one last question from my side. Now with AI uh uh entering various business 57:08 57 minutes, 8 seconds uh processes, there will be changes uh in the way decisions will be made across all business processes. Be it 57:16 57 minutes, 16 seconds manufacturing, be it uh sales, marketing, finance, legal everything. Uh so how do you see uh it changing the 57:25 57 minutes, 25 seconds dynamics in paint industry because lot of decisions are made even now also on lot of u maybe channel feedback which 57:33 57 minutes, 33 seconds may not be 100% in organized way or lot of demand planning commodity sourcing everything is done but uh may not be in 57:41 57 minutes, 41 seconds a 100% organized way which may change post uh AI so how do you see uh things 57:48 57 minutes, 48 seconds changing in the entire uh paint industry And as far as indigo is concerned, how do you see the preparedness means 57:55 57 minutes, 55 seconds whether any large capex uh in terms of software or data management or any other uh will be required? Uh and uh how should we think on those lines? Yeah. 58:06 58 minutes, 6 seconds Thanks. 58:06 58 minutes, 6 seconds Uh no anid I mean AI remains uh as much of a blackbox to us as to industry at 58:14 58 minutes, 14 seconds large. It's it's a very fast evolving space. Although lot of investments in AI 58:22 58 minutes, 22 seconds are happening from the people who are inventing these AI models, 58:28 58 minutes, 28 seconds uh its practical use on a large scale has been begun to be evident in very 58:35 58 minutes, 35 seconds very select sectors. You know it like when it comes to coding is is one sector where you can see some meaningful use impact. 58:45 58 minutes, 45 seconds You can see some impact in medical research where you know the list of possible kinds of molecules that could 58:54 58 minutes, 54 seconds cure a certain disease are getting generated by AI and that's what we hear we haven't heard of any great breakthrough that has yet happened in 59:02 59 minutes, 2 seconds medical research with AI and a little bit in terms of I mean we have been 59:09 59 minutes, 9 seconds using AI in a small way for content creation and for visualizations 59:15 59 minutes, 15 seconds etc. in blogs on our website. But those are very small kind of case studies as 59:23 59 minutes, 23 seconds far as what AI can do. So I think that we have to hold our horses, let some 59:29 59 minutes, 29 seconds practical use case scenarios emerge as to how AI can be used in day-to-day working. 59:38 59 minutes, 38 seconds In the near future, I don't expect any major upheavalss to happen in the way in which we take decisions. I certainly do 59:47 59 minutes, 47 seconds not expect any capex in investing in AI in any significant way from a company of our size. we remain watchful and as and 59:56 59 minutes, 56 seconds when we see some uh actual use case scenarios to which these AI models can be put to maybe in some data analytics 1:00:06 1 hour, 6 seconds or something is the only scenario where I can foresee that it can help us analyze the vast amount of data that we 1:00:13 1 hour, 13 seconds collect more intelligently in a few years from now as these things develop 1:00:20 1 hour, 20 seconds and give us some better insights on maybe how better to focus our trade schemes or our influencer arrangement 1:00:29 1 hour, 29 seconds you know interventions etc but uh I think in companies or in industries like 1:00:36 1 hour, 36 seconds ours we are yet to see any meaningful AI adoption as of now 1:00:43 1 hour, 43 seconds okay sure sir that's uh very helpful many thanks thanks thank you ladies and gentlemen that was the Last 1:00:52 1 hour, 52 seconds question for today. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Thank you and over to you sir. 1:00:58 1 hour, 58 seconds Thanks. Well, thank you all for giving us a patient hearing and asking probing questions. Uh we seem to be feeling the tailwinds of the demand revival. 1:01:12 1 hour, 1 minute, 12 seconds I had mentioned that 3 months ago and the last three months have been good or significantly better than the previous two years. 1:01:20 1 hour, 1 minute, 20 seconds I sincerely hope that this demand comeback maintains itself and accelerates in the 1:01:27 1 hour, 1 minute, 27 seconds days to come so that Indigo Paints comes forward with much better set of uh both 1:01:34 1 hour, 1 minute, 34 seconds topline and bottom line numbers in the ensuing quarters. So thank you all. 1:01:43 1 hour, 1 minute, 43 seconds Thank you on behalf of ICIC Securities Limited. That concludes this conference. 1:01:48 1 hour, 1 minute, 48 seconds Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.